Star Wars Spoilers Thread [Spoilers]

So here's my review: 100% a Star Wars film which belongs with the original trilogy.

It's a transitional film, but it does it well. The new generation is really good.

I think the major death was kinda signposted a bit. You knew it was coming long before it happened. I felt worse for Chewie, but he, Rey, and BB8 make a great team.

Is this the first Star Wars film where nobody gets their hand cut off?

Luke lives in Ireland, eh?

Question: WHY was there a map to Luke, and why was it split into two? I feel like I missed something. For that matter, why a map and not just some coordinates? Seems like a random puzzle set up for the sake of it.

 

[Umbran]

Isn't there an OSHA (Occupational Safety and Health Administration) that would require some safety rails on small walkways over large mechanical chasms????

No, in the Empire and its decendants it is the SHSA (Sith Health and Safety Administration). The appropriate regulation is 137.43/9ZA, and it says, "Do what you're told or a lightsaber takes your head off".

This is closely related to regulation 137.42/8RM which says, "Let the Wookie win."

Also, where did the engineers for these bases earn their degrees?

"Not Get Force-Choked University". Where did you get yours?

Where were the Y wings? Did I miss them? Arent those the actual Bombers you would want on a bombing run?

In EU canon, the Y-wings are already old at the time of A New Hope, iirc. In this... the Resistance is funded, but that funding has limits. They aren't a fully-equipped military.

 

[Leatherhead]

You realize that she's not really more competent than Finn

That's my problem with it.

I find it believable for Finn to know how to exploit the incompetence in his fellow Troopers, seeing as how that is a case of "knowing yourself." His flaws would be similar to the flaws of every other Trooper due to the way they are brought up. Perhaps it is a bit more believable for me because I was in the military myself. And while he does continue to lie to everyone he meets, it gets exposed and resolved quickly. His escape from the base may or may not have been helped along by Kylo Ren (who knew what was up) conveniently looking the other way while it happened, in order to cause trouble for the General.

Rey vs Kylo Ren is trying to do the same thing. But in this case they are opposites. Which makes Kylo Ren look totally incompetent despite the fact he already has significant (if incomplete) training and did Anakin's "kill all the younglings" bit before the movie started. When your main antagonist looks totally incompetent, it makes the Hero look artificially too good.

 

[MarkB]

Where were the Y wings? Did I miss them? Arent those the actual Bombers you would want on a bombing run?

They're marginally more capable in that role than X-Wings, yes, but they were already an outdated design by the time of the original trilogy, with X-Wings able to match or outperform them in most roles.

It's a similar progression to that seen in real-world military aircraft over the last several decades, with dedicated tactical bombers being largely phased out in favour of multirole aircraft that can perform well as both fighters and bombers.

 

[Umbran]

Rey vs Kylo Ren is trying to do the same thing. But in this case they are opposites.

No they aren't. They establish early on that she's no novice to armed combat.

And the comparison of styles in various trilogies is astonishingly clear - compare the prequels, with its wuxia-esque lightsaber combat, to this.

Which makes Kylo Ren look totally incompetent despite the fact he already has significant (if incomplete) training and did Anakin's "kill all the younglings" bit before the movie started.

He's not supposed to be amazingly competent, yet. He's not actually a slouch, though. He can take on a trained fighter while injured (Finn), but he can't take on multiple fresh attackers in a row. He's formidable to a normal human - stormtroopers and First Order officers won't want to cross him, as individuals, but he is not supposed to be Vader.

Note in the flashback, Ben had six or seven people helping him deal with the apprentices. The only real threat there was probably Luke. And if they had a lick of sense they'd have done it while Luke wasn't right in front of them. That step was probably less a test of his combat prowess (because they were apprentices, likely no more advanced than himself) but of his emotional commitment to Snoke.

 

[Jester David]

It is a repeated trope, yes. But that's what genre pieces do - stick to a set of tropes to support common themes and styles. Megaweapons are a Star Wars trope.

Right, and a new megaweapon might be fun. But a planetoid super weapon that shoots big beams and destroys planets but is blown up by a small fighter? That's when it crosses the line from trope to "been there, done that".

Even if you include the battle droid ship from Episode One and the super star destroyer in the "super weapon" camp, only 4/6ths had superweapons and half were planet destroyers and spherical.

Why not something akin to the star forge from Knights of the Old Republic? Or a starkiller that just destroys stars and leaves freezing planets behind? Or something that makes use of the Force showing it's not insignificant in comparison to the Death Star.
Or any of a dozen new ideas that are something different than the Death Star just turned up to 11?

Even the movie itself seems to treat the megaweapon as irrelevant and tacked-on. The Starkiller Base also just seems to come out of left field. Halfway through the movie the evil bad guys just develop this new scheme. "Oh yeah, and we have this crazy weapon." Why were they even bothering with anything in the first half when they were just going to obliterate the rest?
The map is somewhat important, but at the end that doesn't seem to matter since they were quite willing to just destroy the Resistance anyway. (How they knew where the Resistance were is another matter.)

 

[Jester David]

Rey vs Kylo Ren is trying to do the same thing. But in this case they are opposites. Which makes Kylo Ren look totally incompetent despite the fact he already has significant (if incomplete) training and did Anakin's "kill all the younglings" bit before the movie started. When your main antagonist looks totally incompetent, it makes the Hero look artificially too good.

I initially reacted to that poorly, wondering when she learned to fight with a lightsaber. But she was more competent in hand to hand combat, and does use a staff. Melee is her thing, opposed to Finn who was a blaster man. I totally buy her being a saber natural.

 

[werecorpse]

I quite enjoyed it. I liked the 4 young new characters, Po, Finn, Rey & Kylo.
I felt it drew too much from movies 4-6 (especially 4) - it's like Hollywood have got used to just making reboots and remakes. (Desert planet, ice planet, forest planet)
I thought Harrison Ford's performance was generally poor, more Ham Solo than I would have liked- the quips, the blind shot over the shoulder etc made it feel like he was performing in a remake of spaceballs rather than Star Wars.
I felt the star killer base was unecessary and annoying (rerun plus were the shields, the prison and the exhaust port (or whatever weakness it was) all in the same building?) and the first order didn't just have a nod to the third reich, they all but goose stepped.
I also disliked the final quick trip to Luke. They should have ended it after the battle and shown Luke getting ready or something -saved the meeting of Luke (who we all know anyway and who didn't reveal anything) until movie 8.
I liked BB-8, the small glasses lady, the storm trooper turning good, I wasn't bothered by Rey's competence (she is just less whiny farm boy more competent street rat than Luke - I'm fine with that) though her use of the force seemed a bit advanced. I felt Kylo's loss might have been partially due to having just killed his father, being shot by chewbacca's weapon that plainly packs a punch, and having fought Finn.
I liked Solo's death scene, Finns relationship with Po and Rey, Rey telling Finn to stop holding my hand while we run.

All in all a welcome addition to Star Wars after episodes 1-3 went off track IMO.

 

[lyle.spade]

They're marginally more capable in that role than X-Wings, yes, but they were already an outdated design by the time of the original trilogy, with X-Wings able to match or outperform them in most roles.

It's a similar progression to that seen in real-world military aircraft over the last several decades, with dedicated tactical bombers being largely phased out in favour of multirole aircraft that can perform well as both fighters and bombers.

I was thinking about my dear Y-Wings when the squadron took off for the attack...looked for them, and knew they'd likely not be there. They were current during the Clone Wars, and old by the time the Rebellion starting blowing things up. I remember reading somewhere they they had no body panels by EpIV: mechanics had spent so much time fixing them that they stopped bothering putting them back on.

I actually like them more in the EpIV-VI style, rather than from the Clone Wars; I guess I just got used to them looking so rough.

 

[lyle.spade]

From what I've read of others' thoughts, Luke didn't make a map for people to find him.
He was plotting his course using R2D2 as he sought out the First Temple. The last section was shown to him by Max Von Sydow's character, whom reproduced that piece for Leia. Luke had R2 intentionally power down when he was given the last piece just in case Kylo Ren found the droid.

Makes sense.

That makes a lot of sense - thanks! I'm going to use that.

Q: what/who was Max Von Sydow supposed to be?

 

[Jester David]

double post somehow...