Spoilers Star Wars: The Acolyte [Spoilers]

[Ryujin]

There's no way we're not getting some extensive flashbacks at some point, maybe a whole episode.

They'll definitely need to fully explain the reason for needing revenge, at some point, so we'll see all of those Jedi again.

 

[Hussar]

I have zero confidence in live action SW now.

Ok, so, I gotta ask.

You've listed that you've watched pretty much all of the live action Star Wars offerings. I think the only one you didn't mention was Obi-Wan. Oh, and Book too. That's right. And you've disliked them all. Which is absolutely cool and not a problem. You're certainly not alone in not liking them and there's absolutely no one that should tell you that you're wrong for not liking something.

But, like I said, I gotta ask. Why do you keep watching? Two seasons of Mando? A season of Ahsoka? Now this new series? If you so dislike it, why on earth do you keep watching? That's the thing that I just don't get from fans. When I don't like something, I ... don't watch it. I watch other stuff. I never got into Game of Thrones. I watched the first two or three episodes and... just stopped watching. I didn't like Shadow and Bone. I watched the first two or three and then... stopped.

What is it that makes you come back to the well time after time, only to be disappointed?

 

[Reynard]

Ok, so, I gotta ask.

You've listed that you've watched pretty much all of the live action Star Wars offerings. I think the only one you didn't mention was Obi-Wan. Oh, and Book too. That's right. And you've disliked them all. Which is absolutely cool and not a problem. You're certainly not alone in not liking them and there's absolutely no one that should tell you that you're wrong for not liking something.

But, like I said, I gotta ask. Why do you keep watching? Two seasons of Mando? A season of Ahsoka? Now this new series? If you so dislike it, why on earth do you keep watching? That's the thing that I just don't get from fans. When I don't like something, I ... don't watch it. I watch other stuff. I never got into Game of Thrones. I watched the first two or three episodes and... just stopped watching. I didn't like Shadow and Bone. I watched the first two or three and then... stopped.

What is it that makes you come back to the well time after time, only to be disappointed?

It is hard to complain on the internet if you don't watch. Duh.

 

[Hussar]

It is hard to complain on the internet if you don't watch. Duh.

I guess? I just don't really understand the mindset of hatewatching. There's lots of genre stuff that I don't watch. I don't watch it because it either doesn't interest me or I don't like it. The notion of watching many hours of a show that I strongly dislike just seems bizarre to me. I get watching some movie or other to make fun of it MST3K style. That's a blast, especially with friends.

But spending dozens of hours watching episode after episode of a show I hate just so I can bitch about it later? WTF? Who does that?

 

[Reynard]

Who does that?

"fans."

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Do you honestly think a discussion of subjective opinions about specific peoples' writing quality across Star Wars media has the slightest chance of going anywhere positive?

I think you're going to be so insulting to pretty successful and decent writers as to call them not even "A, B or C team", you absolutely need to stand up and admit what your specific preferences are, and explain that position, because it's a quite a thing to say.

I get it. No one is allowed to have a negative opinion unless it is nefarious and toxic.

Come on dude, don't make this about you being an "UwU smol bean" or something. That's absolutely "toxic" behaviour - you're just making it true! If you take a giant crap on people, you can be asked why you're doing that. Period. I've been asked it before, and rightly so when I've been being harsh!

But credit to you, you have responded to most of the points. I don't disagree with all of what you're saying either. I mean, let's be clear - if you want to know what "A-team" writing actually looks like, that's Andor. That is inarguably, objectively, factually, Hollywood's A-team there. Tony Gilroy is ultra-experienced writer, who has won Oscars, and who is brought in to fix other people's screwed-up projects (including Rogue One).

So you throw around "A, B and C teams", and that's way A-team looks like and you still don't like it.

And that's okay, but we've got to be real - it really looks like you just don't like live action SW, with only a little allowance for whether it's good or bad. Which is fine, but means you shouldn't be taking a crap on the writers like that. Because the main issue you have isn't with them. That's clear when you saying 66% of Andor was bad/mid - it simply isn't - it's slow-paced but it's vital to how the show works, and lot of it was pretty amazing as character studies/studies on the rise of fascism, etc.

I am a huge Ahsoka fan and I really love Rosario Dawson. She plays an older Ahsoka very well and Natasha was a great casting choice for Sabine, but the show was garbage. It did not even get to the point until the final 2 episodes. I really like Baylin, but they did nothing with him or his apprentice. The character changes for Sabine were just bad and took her backwards from Rebels and the explanation and shoehorning her as a force -user were done poorly.

100% agree!

I just watched the rest of Ahsoka and oof.

The critique I would add is that whilst Dawson is spot-on for Ahsoka (and even her costumes make her look "Ahsoka-shaped", which is a real achievement in costuming), she's essentially doing an "Ahsoka impression" - indeed all of the actors who are playing characters from Rebels are doing impressions of those characters. This thus isn't down to the actors choosing that, but the showrunner (Filoni) making them take that approach. And Dawson's impression of animated Ahsoka is good that it actually it goes into a kind of reverse uncanny valley, where it's distracting and offputting because I keep basically seeing animated Ahsoka - she has all the body and face language and little things animated Ahsoka does down perfectly.

It's a show where for real 60% of it could have been cut and it would have been a better show if they did.

It would also have been a better show if it was animated. Filoni is simply showing he is not cutting it showrunning live-action at remotely the level he was managing to showrun animated shows. Rebels was great as you say. But with Rebels you make allowances for stuff because it's show for kids/teens and animated - and the same allowances don't apply for a live-action show, so you have really stupid-seeming and drawn out scenes a lot of the time. Filoni is too self-indulgent, frankly. He needs to be answering to someone else. He need criticism. Favreau suffers from the same issues. They'd probably do a much better job with some actual pressure on them.

What you didn't answer though was games and movies. I'm not demanding you do, this is enough of answer, but I think it would be helpful if, in future, you suggest you don't just generally dislike live-action SW, you listed some movies which were good, because you only seemed to list ones you didn't like.

No. It is just meant to try to generate a "gotcha" moment so that a person can be labeled and dismissed. I could be wrong about the intent and I apologize if I am, but it sounded like an attempt at a personal attack.

The only person who can gotcha you, is you.

I wanted to pull out your specific position re: writing, and to me it looks like you don't really appreciate good writing very much, and dislike live action shows. That's fine, as I said, but you should refrain from wildly insulting the writers unless your critiques are more specific. And the idea that Leslye Headland of all people "isn't even C-team" remains laughable.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

"fans."

Yeah this is the problem.

And it's not always that fans are like, malicious - though sometimes they are and genuinely "hatewatching" - sometimes it's just that they're "consuming content" rather than "engaging with art", and because this content is branded "Star Wars" and they feel like must consume all "Star Wars" brand content. They consume it even when they don't like it, and they don't learn "actually maybe I shouldn't consume this", they just get annoyed!

Sometimes it's boredom or having something on in the background, for better or worse - that's why I finished watching Ahsoka - I knew it wasn't great but I also wanted to know what happened, and could have it on whilst I worked, because it didn't require the same level of engagement as an actually-good show.

Sometimes, and perhaps most insidiously, it's hope. People think something is going to get better. Fans are particularly bad for this. And this is also where you get some of the nastiest stuff coming from - fans get incredibly, psychotically angry when their expectations aren't met.

TLJ is the perfect example here - or the ST generally - the curious division there was in part (only in part) because some people were genuinely open-minded about it, for whatever reasons, and others had incredibly specific ideas for what they thought happened "after the OT", usually strongly grounded/rooted in old EU/Legends stuff. Those people kept hoping that their ideas, their thoughts, their hopes would be vindicated, and for the most part they never were, and I think that made them very, very angry.

I don't claim this is alien to me, note - I'm only a "fan" of a very few things (Mass Effect, maybe Star Trek), and I've experienced similar emotions re: those. But as I've got older I've got better at just ditching things (looking at you, Star Trek: Discovery and probably the Academy series, because the 32nd century ain't working for me, despite a good cast).

Anyway, back on topic, I thought the Acolyte was pretty fun and pacey and am looking forwards to more - pacey particularly isn't something any other live-action show (or even really the animated shows) have been, but we're waiting on Wednesday for more!

 

[Belen]

What is it that makes you come back to the well time after time, only to be disappointed?

Because it is Star Wars. I saw A New Hope in theaters when I was 4 and they rereleased it. It had a profound effect on me. It is the one property that is a constant for me.

I keep watching hoping that it will improve and I will like the next show.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Because it is Star Wars. I saw A New Hope in theaters when I was 4 and they rereleased it. It had a profound effect on me. It is the one property that is a constant for me.

I keep watching hoping that it will improve and I will like the next show.

It will improve next time you are 4.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

There's no way we're not getting some extensive flashbacks at some point, maybe a whole episode.

Plus the scene when she takes off her dark helmet!

Although there is a reason why you might use her: have you seen Robin Hood Prince of Thieves? Sean Connery is only in if for a couple of minutes - they are relying on the actor’s established typecasting to instantly establish the character. Not that I think that is happening here.