Sudden Maxmized Explosive Runes

[Sporelock]

Is there anything that prevents a spellcaster from using Sudden Maximize on permanent-until-discharged spells like Explosive Runes or Fire Trap?

 

[Infiniti2000]

No. Why would there be?

 

[Sporelock]

Usually to Maximize a 3rd level spell the caster needs a 6th level spell slot to use, but Sudden Maximize removes that need. It balances in combat because you can only use it 1x per day but with spells that last until discharged, the balance factor seems to go away. The one time per day limit is not a factor for spells that are cast as preparation and traps, and it means that a caster can get maximum damage on those types of spells for no extra cost or effort. A 5th level caster being able to guarantee doing 36 pts of damage with Explosive Runes seems a bit much. A cleric that is already going to Glyph up his headquarters can pump up all the damage it does.

Nothing horribly out of whack but it seems a bit too much.

 

[Asmor]

I've got no problem with that, personally. Anything to encourage planning is alright in my books.

As a side note, maybe it's just my style of DMing, but it's exceedingly rare for the PCs to be in a position where they are the ones setting up traps. They're always the ones charging headlong into the darkness.

 

[Patlin]

I sure hope it's not prohibitted, I've been planning to do it!

I might not get to lay traps, but I'll be darned if I can't make it work in my favor somehow.

Me: "OK! OK! You got me! The treasure map is all yours!"

NPC: "Treasure Map? What Treasure Map?"

Me: "Damn! You didn't even know about the treasure map? I don't suppose you'd let me keep it then?"

NPC: "Give it over!"

*BOOM*

Tee hee!

 

[Quidam]

items?

If applying the sudden metamagic feats doesn't raise the spell level, how does that affect item creation? Is a wand of suddenly maximized magic missile more expensive to create than a normal wand? Anyone got a rules citation? You can use the feat once per day, but you only need to cast the spell once per day for item creation, IIRC.

 

[Bad Paper]

Most of these problems go away if you apply the "incantrix rule" to any of these metamagic feats. Thus, yes, you may cast a sudden maximized explosive runes, but only if you can otherwise cast sixth-level spells. I try to keep house rules out of my campaign, but when the ninth-level cleric was dropping maximized flame strikes on enemies, I -- how do you say -- nerfed that sucker.

 

[mikebr99]

If applying the sudden metamagic feats doesn't raise the spell level, how does that affect item creation? Is a wand of suddenly maximized magic missile more expensive to create than a normal wand? Anyone got a rules citation? You can use the feat once per day, but you only need to cast the spell once per day for item creation, IIRC.

Can sudden metamagic feats (from Complete Arcane) be
used to scribe scrolls or craft wands that include the
metamagic effect? If so, how would you calculate the cost
(since sudden metamagic feats don’t alter the level of the
spell)?
You can use a sudden metamagic feat in item creation; the
cost to create the item would be just as if you were using the
regular metamagic feat. For instance, using your Sudden Widen
feat to create a scroll of widened fireball would cost as much as
a scroll of a 6th-level spell (which is what a widened fireball
is). The act of creating the scroll or wand would expend your
daily use of Sudden Widen (since the act of creation triggers
the spell, making it unavailable for casting).

Mike

 

[Sporelock]

I definitely agree that players are usually reacting and attacking rather than plotting and planning but it does happen. I have always liked the idea of using trap spells offensively for characters I have run. Hand a guard a piece of paper saying “Here are your orders” and he is likely to read it whether be believes you or not. Leaving an interesting book or a map laying around is easy enough temptation for someone just to read it. A package with a name written on it, etc.

The reader of Explosive Runes takes the full 36 points of force damage without a save which would be a nice chunk of damage for a 5th level caster and not even deplete his spells for the day.

I realized that Fire Trap is not an issue because the base damage is only 1d4! Glyph of Warding seems like the only other spell that really gets a boost from Sudden Maximize because the caster could guarantee that Inflict Wounds would do 24 hps, or Summon Monster 3 would summon 5 first level monsters. Greater Glyph might have more problems in store though.

 

[frankthedm]

IMNSHO other than the sudden still and sudden silence the "sudden metamagic" feats are too good. Sure the PCs can use this sort of thing, but chances are they will be nailed by this sort of thing. Often. Which they deserve if they were the ones who asked for these overpowered feats.