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Take A Look At The DUNE Character Sheet!

Modiphius has shared the Dune: Adventures in the Imperium character sheet. The preview packages which come with pre-orders have been updated with these in PDF format (including a printer-friendly version).

dune_ch_1.jpg
 

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Russ Morrissey

Russ Morrissey

What does the game do to prevent people from using the same combo every time? I'm kind of confused on this challenging the value, etc, idea.
When you challenge the value's belief statement, you cannot use that value again until end of session, at which point you must alter the belief statement. Not of need a total rewrite, but it must change a little.

Without challenging, if the belief statement isn't a fit with the action, the GM says, "No, pick something else"
Other than that, nothing.
Well, other than that the skills are not as wibbly-wobbley.
 

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Corone

Explorer
When you challenge the value's belief statement, you cannot use that value again until end of session, at which point you must alter the belief statement. Not of need a total rewrite, but it must change a little.

Without challenging, if the belief statement isn't a fit with the action, the GM says, "No, pick something else"
Other than that, nothing.
Well, other than that the skills are not as wibbly-wobbley.
Very true, and not every drive will fit each situation. Each one puts a twist on the test that makes it a little different and creates potentially different outcomes.
However, it is fine to play to your strengths and try and use your best drive each time, but that means you need to manipulate the situation to allow you that option - the essence of politics and intrigue.
Having said that, use the same approach again and again and your enemies will begin to predict you, and that is very dangerous.
 


PRAdams

Villager
Someone was complaining (don't recall if it was here or on RPGG) the other day about how far STA was from Mutant Chronicles... well, this one is further still.
Probably me. A lack of meaningful mechanics (or ultra-generic mechanics that handle everything with what amounts to a hand wave) are not automatically the gateway to narrative gaming any more than a wee bit of crunch in a system prevents narrative control.

I can't imagine being more turned off from a game than seeing this character sheet. Meh. :(
 

Probably me. A lack of meaningful mechanics (or ultra-generic mechanics that handle everything with what amounts to a hand wave) are not automatically the gateway to narrative gaming any more than a wee bit of crunch in a system prevents narrative control.

I can't imagine being more turned off from a game than seeing this character sheet. Meh. :(
It does solve the Conan/STA issue with generating tons of threat to buy success, by limiting the amount of effect bought.
 

MGibster

Legend
What I wonder is how the game is going to offer roleplaying opportunities outside of established history.
There's thousands of years of history to play. I'm kind of interested in what it means to be playing in the era of the God Emperor. What does player agency mean in the context of the Golden Path?
 



Shardstone

Adventurer
Publisher
When you challenge the value's belief statement, you cannot use that value again until end of session, at which point you must alter the belief statement. Not of need a total rewrite, but it must change a little.

Without challenging, if the belief statement isn't a fit with the action, the GM says, "No, pick something else"
Other than that, nothing.
Well, other than that the skills are not as wibbly-wobbley.
So what happens when you run out of values from the 5 or so rolls that could be?
 


Crusadius

Explorer
It’s stuff like this that pushes me closer to pushing the button on the pre-order.

I’ve already got a list of things to buy in 2021 so it’s annoying because if I do then something is going to be pushed back.
... and it's stuff like the high postage makes me step back. Sheesh. Might have to wait until it's in stock at a LGS or Amazon.
 

PRAdams

Villager
It does solve the Conan/STA issue with generating tons of threat to buy success, by limiting the amount of effect bought.
To me, that can be solved by establishing a limit up front. No need to take a rules system down to a handful of stats/skills. The problem with this approach quickly becomes the same problem with Fate, where your aspect becomes a hammer, and every challenge becomes a nail.

"Well, surely if I'm the World's Greatest Detective, then I should be able to get a discount on my hotel room."
"Well, surely if I'm the World's Greatest Detective, then I should be able to get a complimentary speedboat rental."
"Well, surely if I'm the World's Greatest Detective, then I should be able to convince the hostess to let me use her computer system."

No clearly defined stats/skills leads to players maxing out a favorable pair and constantly arguing that this min/max combination should apply in every single situation (or you're stealing their agency and ruining their character build!). It's a bad design that puts GMs in a position to always have to be the bad guy. In my experience, abusive play is the norm, even with good players. They don't even realize they're slipping into the bad behavior.
 

mykesfree

Explorer
@PRAdams I have played lots of STA and Conan that uses a similar system. I have yet to see your hammer and nail problem.

In 2d20 games it is assumed that characters are hyper competent at what they do and understand many things about the task they are about to attempt. The GM gives the difficulty of the task before hand and what are applicable Dives and Skills.

The example you gave are all versions of persuading a person to give you something. For this system it looks like it would be an applicable Drive + Communicate task. What I find interesting about this game and Dune in particular is that depending who you ae asking it might change the drive. Maybe when asking for a hotel room, the person you are speaking to is a Freemen, so maybe your drive in Faith or Justice might have more weight. On Caladan when asking for a speedboat, maybe it the drive for Truth, that can convince the person to give you a speedboat rental. On Giedi Prime for computer system access maybe the drive is Power.
 

mykesfree

Explorer
@Shardstone If this is like other 2d20 games, then taking actions are not dependent on how many Statements/Values that you have. When you use a value/statement on task roll, it increases your success chances by a lot.

Most of the time a character or group of characters can accomplish a task, but if you really want it to succeed that is when a character plays into a value.
 



PRAdams

Villager
@PRAdams I have played lots of STA and Conan that uses a similar system. I have yet to see your hammer and nail problem.

In 2d20 games it is assumed that characters are hyper competent at what they do and understand many things about the task they are about to attempt. The GM gives the difficulty of the task before hand and what are applicable Dives and Skills.

The example you gave are all versions of persuading a person to give you something. For this system it looks like it would be an applicable Drive + Communicate task. What I find interesting about this game and Dune in particular is that depending who you ae asking it might change the drive. Maybe when asking for a hotel room, the person you are speaking to is a Freemen, so maybe your drive in Faith or Justice might have more weight. On Caladan when asking for a speedboat, maybe it the drive for Truth, that can convince the person to give you a speedboat rental. On Giedi Prime for computer system access maybe the drive is Power.
I''m referring to Fate specifically (where aspects are the hammer and everything becomes a nail to be driven in by the aspect). However, the problem with, say, John Carter could be the same if the GM wanted to go that way. The notion that you don't need skills because...you're already competent in some set of skills (but go ahead and write down a handful if that'll help you) is just lazy.

If you like systems that involve a lot of handwaving, that's fine. It's a matter of taste. I find them uninteresting. There's a massive gulf between, say, Conan and John Carter 2d20. You could make a much less crunchy version of Conan if you want a high-speed John Carter game without going to the level they did with the design. They chose otherwise, so I've passed on buying anything outside of the core rulebook. For that same reason, I'll pass on Dune and other systems that are too scaled down for my taste.
 

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