D&D 4E Talents and Talent trees in 4E?

[Remathilis]

Talent trees have not yet been mentioned inany previews or blurbs, yet they are such a sweet concept it would be silly for them not to be included. Therefore I think talents and talent tree's are most definately in, but have been renamed into powers/power tree's.

This has probably been done due to the MMORPG influence (i.e. in Wolrd of warcraft everyclass gets 'oH dEh kEwl powaHz') to draw in new players.

Thoughts?

Yeah.

d20 Modern: 2002
D&D 3.5: 2003
World of Warcraft: 2004

I think they're doing a better job of ripping off being influenced by d20 Modern than WoW.

 

[Gort]

Diablo 2: 2000
d20 Modern: 2002
D&D 3.5: 2003
World of Warcraft: 2004

Fixed that for you.

However, I think the argument is moot - I don't care where they've stolen ideas from as long as they work well.

 

[Lord Zack]

We know that classes will be getting some sort of class features besides powers. Rogues for example get Trapfinding automatically. I don't know if they'd actually have talents like Saga though. They could just have bonus feats.

 

[Goblyn]

Fixed that for you.

However, I think the argument is moot - I don't care where they've stolen ideas from as long as they work well.

Agreed. While extremely hak-n-slash, Diablo2 had some excellent and very yoink-worthy ideas; skill trees not being the least of which(anyone else notice 'item sets' in MIC? Diablo2 did that too.)

 

[Ranger REG]

However, I think the argument is moot - I don't care where they've stolen ideas from as long as they work well.

You can steal ideas, you just can't steal copyrights.

 

[Dausuul]

Talents/powers have been around since the release of 3E. Back then, of course, they were called "feats." When you get right down to it, 4E is just separating general-purpose feats from class-specific ones (Weapon Specialization, metamagic, et cetera), and renaming the latter as "powers."

 

[Lord Zack]

No powers are stuff you do. Weapon Specialization is a passive benefit.

 

[Dausuul]

No powers are stuff you do. Weapon Specialization is a passive benefit.

*shrug* Okay, substitute Whirlwind Attack for Weapon Specialization. (It's not technically fighter-only, but it has so many prerequisite feats that it's effectively available only to those with levels in fighter.)

Regardless, the idea of "special tricks" that a character chooses from as s/he levels is one that has been around since the dawn of 3E. In fact, wizards have had such a mechanic since the dawn of D&D. 4E is just merging feats, spells, and class abilities into a single concept.

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

I got the impression that there were three different categories:

1. 4e FEATS are non-class specific and almost entirely untiered - that is, there are very few (or no) feats that list OTHER feats as prerequisites. They're relatively minor, situational benefits.

2. 4e TALENTS are class-specific and highly tiered - that is, they're structured more like "trees" from WoW, with lots of talents that list other talents as prerequisites. Most (or all) "class special abilities" from 3e would be talents in 4e, allowing for more flexible classes.

3. 4e POWERS are actions that can be at-will, per-encounter, or per-day. Many of them are class specific (like wizard spells or fighter "stunts"), but others are race specific (like that elven reroll power). Others might well be tied to paragon paths or epic destinies.

 

[Dr. Strangemonkey]

Rogues for example get Trapfinding automatically.

I think trapfinding is a feat that Rogues get automatically, ala Force Sensitive and Jedi in Saga.

Which fits with both the, 'Feats give you flat new abilities that are useful throughout the life of the character,' principle, and the 'there are no more essential classes' principle.

I wonder:

If there really is a distinction between powers and talents, and feats serve to put more attachments onto the swiss army knife that is your character...

could we be seeing a Power, feat, Talent cycle in terms of character benefits? There are 30 levels after all.

Man, I wish they would give us a class write up to match the race write up we got for Christmas.

Maybe for MLK day?