TH Weapon in 1 Hand

[Korak]

The intent seems pretty clear though. If you're using 2 hands you get the 1.5 str bonus. If you don't, then you don't.

How is it unclear?

It's not that simple. Two hands applied to the grip of a weapon is not the only criteria. You don't get 1.5 time str bonus when using a light weapon in two hands. In fact, the only category of weapons that deal a different amount of damage for being wielded in two hands are one-handed weapons. More importantlu, the categorization of melee weapons as light, one-handed, and two-handed had many more functions in the rules as writted in the PHB 3.5. Those categories factored into the rules for item durability, for sunders, for disarms, for using weapons designed for different sized wielders, and more. The amount of strength bonus applied to damage rolls was only one issue, and even then, there was not one simple rule based on the number of hands used that applied across weapon categories. Each category had it's own rules.

Author's intent can sometimes be teased out of a large body of rules. However, I would only try to resort to that method when the rules are not written clearly. Here, they are written clearly.

Lastly, once more, let me say that what I've said above is my best reading of what the actual rules in the PHB say. It is not necessarily my opinion of how it "should" work. If anyone wants to have a balance discussion for the purpose of coming up with good rule 0 applications, I'm all for it.

 

[Korak]

The primary issue I have with the FAQ answer is "a longsword wielded in two hands is a two-handed weapon" and "the table lists weapons as light, one-handed, or two-handed as a convenience" (!?).

-Hyp.

Yeah, the convenience line is what really got me. It seemed to reveal a great lack of understanding for how the PHB rules were arranged. Each weapon had a category (light, one-handed, two-handed) a size (small, medium, etc) and possibly special rules (reach, tripping, etc). Each of those factors was well described. To just ignore part of that structure (the table), and then directly contradict page 113's weapon category rules didn't seem like an appropriate way to "clarify" rules in the FAQ.

 

[irdeggman]

It's not that simple. Two hands applied to the grip of a weapon is not the only criteria. You don't get 1.5 time str bonus when using a light weapon in two hands. In fact, the only category of weapons that deal a different amount of damage for being wielded in two hands are one-handed weapons.

This is incorrect.

The only type of weapons that don't gain a 1 1/2 times Str mod when wielded with 2 hands are light weapons. It just happens that 2 handed weapons can't be wielded with one hand unless crossing the "size" boundary. That is when things actually get complicated (accoutnig for the size of the weapon and the type of the weapon).

So basically it depends on how you look at it.

Is it that weapons being wielded with 2 hands do more damage or the type of weapon being used at all that matters?

 

[pawsplay]

A two-handed undersized weapon is wielded as a one-handed weapon. That is not the same as the lance situation, where it can simply be wielded in one hand.

 

[Mavrik]

If an undersized TH weapon can be wielded in one hand, then could you use an undersized lance in one hand and gain 1.5STR damage, but not a full size lance ?

 

[mvincent]

Is it that weapons being wielded with 2 hands do more damage or the type of weapon being used at all that matters?

From all precedence I've seen, the writer's intended the former. This is why the FAQ clarification never seemed surprising to me.

 

[Korak]

This is incorrect.

What, precisely, is incorrect?

Light, One-Handed, and Two-Handed Melee Weapons:….
Light: A light weapon is easier to use in one’s off hand than a one-handed weapon is, and it can be used while grappling. A light weapon is used in one hand. Add the wielder’s Strength bonus (if any) to damage rolls for melee attacks with a light weapon if it’s used in the primary hand, or one-half the wielder’s Strength bonus if it’s used in the off hand. Using two hands to wield a light weapon gives no advantage on damage; the Strength bonus applies as though the weapon were held in the wielder’s primary hand only.
An unarmed strike is always considered a light weapon.
One-Handed: A one-handed weapon can be used in either the primary hand or the off hand. Add the wielder’s Strength bonus to damage rolls for melee attacks with a one-handed weapon if it’s used in the primary hand, or ½ his or her Strength bonus if it’s used in the off hand. If a one-handed weapon is wielded with two hands during melee combat, add 1-1/2 times the character’s Strength bonus to damage rolls.
Two-Handed: Two hands are required to use a two handed melee weapon effectively. Apply 1-1/2 times the character’s Strength bonus to damage rolls for melee attacks with such a weapon.

I see 3 categories of weapons listed. Only 2 (light, one-handed) of those categories give a different amount of strength bonus on damage rolls based on the number or type of hands wielding them. Only 1 (one-handed) of those categories does a different amount of damage when comparing wielding in the primary hand vs wielding in two hands. Of course, by standard rules in this section, it is not possible to wield a two handed weapon in only the primary hand. That is what the special rules in a few places are for(most notably the provision to use a lance in one hand while mounted).

Is it that weapons being wielded with 2 hands do more damage or the type of weapon being used at all that matters?

You ask and either/or question, but the real answer is neither of the possibilities you offer. For light weapons there is no difference between primary hand or two handed wielding, for one-handed weapons there is a difference, and for two-handed weapons there is no difference (though barring special rules, it is not possible to only wield a two-handed weapon in only one hand).

 

[irdeggman]

Korak,

What I am trying to say is:

Is t really a function of the type of weapon (light, 1 handed or 2 handed) or how the weapon is wielded?

If it is how the weapon is wielded then the the truism is that "except for light weapons (and some special ones like rapiers and spiked chains), when a weapon is wielded with 2 hands you add 1 1/2 times your str bonus to damage."

This is how things are presented and the FAQ (and text but not the table) leads one to beleive that is what was intended. It is the table that actually provides confusion - and text trumps tables.

 

[Korak]

Irdeggman, I agree with your interpretation of the designer's intent. However, I disagree with you in that, I see the rules in the PHB as clear. Each of the three categories of melee weapons has the way in which str bonus applies specifically, and separately spelled out. They don't all follow the same rules. I believe the designers intended to write rules in which weapons behave as you describe them, but I think they failed. I think the rules, as they wrote them in the 3.5 PHB, work differently.

 

[pawsplay]

I don't know what the design intent once, or whether the problem was even considered. I do know what the rulebook says, and it says a lance is a two-handed weapon.