D&D General The Brilliance of the Original Gygaxian Multiverse

[DEFCON 1]

It's all such a meta conversation, it doesn't actually matter anyway. We are all millions of omnipotent and omniscient and omnipresent players over the chessboard that is Dungeons & Dragons. And there is no reason to argue terms because none of our own decisions matter in the slightest to any of the other million players across the chessboard. Even if you manage to convince one person here of your "theory" of the multiverse and planescaping and moving between worlds or any of that crap... there are still a million minus one other people for whom nothing has changed. So what do you honestly think you are gaining?

To me, again... it seems to me nothing more than people trying to establish a "canon" for what is "true", and that they end up on the "true" side of things-- because apparently they think that matters. Well, it doesn't. There is no "truth" about any of this. Because it isn't one story. It is hundreds of millions of stories, each with their own individual "truth" (and in many cases, not even that.)

 

[jasper]

.....

One issue with stuffing all the settings in the Prime is the part you quoted about the Ethereal plane touch the Prime and inner planes. If all the settings are in the Prime, it should be fairly simple to travel through the Ether to get to any alternate universe (setting) in the Prime. But that is apparantly not the case (MtG, Eberron, & Athas are all difficult to get to).

The Ethereal plane touches the Prime allows travel to other universes. They catch is one letter. You Could travel to another universe not Would.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

In a parallel universe Hasbro and Matell verged and now He-Man and the Master of the Universe are a D&D world.

The true key of this matter is what are the limits for the canon lore about multiverse. Not only about allowing a crossover with Gamma World or between Ravenloft and the Mask of the Red Death, but D&D with other Hasbro franchises, or some intercompany crossover (for example with a videogame studio).

 

[jasper]

In 1E some one explained the differences as follows. Multi universes exist which you can travel too. Outer Planes are limited but are defined by which multiverse you enter them from. Examples. If you exist in the Marvel universe the outer planes are affect by Marvel lore. Talk to you DM about the multiverse. So, Jasper's 9 layers of hell is based on Dr Strange and Dante's Inferno. Morrus' 9 levels of hell is compiled from all the dragon articles pre 200 issue. Ooafta is using Anime for his 9 layers of hell. Maxperson's hell is base on the Hardcovers.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

You keep referring to multiple "planes" within the Prime Material Plane. Can you provide a quote from the official material with that terminology? At least in later products "plane" has very specific meaning, and in this sort of discussion I think it's worth retaining its technical jargon usage instead of using it as a casual synonym for alternate dimension/reality, unless the source material actually used it casually like that.

 

[Urriak Uruk]

In a parallel universe Hasbro and Matell verged and now He-Man and the Master of the Universe are a D&D world.

The true key of this matter is what are the limits for the canon lore about multiverse. Not only about allowing a crossover with Gamma World or between Ravenloft and the Mask of the Red Death, but D&D with other Hasbro franchises, or some intercompany crossover (for example with a videogame studio).

As the DM canon isn't a limiter, because as soon as you run your first game, you've deviated from canon. Canon should therefore have no relevance on your game if it blocks fun.

There shouldn't be a Ravenloft/Gamma World/whatever crossover because said crossover sounds terrible and WotC should focus on products that are actually... good.

 

[Maxperson]

As the DM canon isn't a limiter, because as soon as you run your first game, you've deviated from canon. Canon should therefore have no relevance on your game if it blocks fun.

That's not true at all. Canon is only what is named, so for instance canon in Waterdeep(going by 2e lore) is that there are secret lords and an open lord. Mirt is one of the secret lords and Piergeiron is the open lord. Change those things and you've altered canon. Simply playing your game in Waterdeep and affecting things that have not been mentioned in canon doesn't deviate from canon in the slightest. Canon leaves open a LOT of blank areas for the PCs to adventure in and keep things true to canon.

 

[Urriak Uruk]

That's not true at all. Canon is only what is named, so for instance canon in Waterdeep(going by 2e lore) is that there are secret lords and an open lord. Mirt is one of the secret lords and Piergeiron is the open lord. Change those things and you've altered canon. Simply playing your game in Waterdeep and affecting things that have not been mentioned in canon doesn't deviate from canon in the slightest. Canon leaves open a LOT of blank areas for the PCs to adventure in and keep things true to canon.

As soon as you start any game, you've deviated from canon. Your player's PCs are not canon characters, and whatever they are doing is not-canon. Crawford himself has said this himself, that as soon as you start your first game in the Forgotten Realms, you are now playing in an "alternate Forgotten Realms," because whatever your doing is not-canon.

Therefore, since you can never truly play in a "canon Forgotten Realms," I'd argue there is no point in trying to remain as "canon as possible" if you find it a limiter on how much fun you're having.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

Sometimes the DM have to alter the canon intentionality to avoid players to know all the metaplot and what is going to happen because they have readen all the fandom wikis.

My question is about if the fandom community would aprove/forgive WotC publishing D&D versions of Hyrule/Legend of Zelda, Final Fantasy or Warcraft.

 

[Urriak Uruk]

Sometimes the DM have to alter the canon intentionality to avoid players to know all the metaplot and what is going to happen because they have readen all the fandom wikis.

My question is about if the fandom community would aprove/forgive WotC publishing D&D versions of Hyrule/Legend of Zelda, Final Fantasy or Warcraft.

Alright @LuisCarlos17f , I'll bite. Why exactly are you so set on crossovers of D&D with other properties? You don't seem to care what the crossovers actually are, or even what properties they're with, as long as they exist.

Why do you care so much? Why on earth do you need D&D Transformers so badly, or Zelda or FF or whatever?

I ask because although on paper some of these ideas aren't bad (an official Hyrule D&D box set isn't the worst idea), you seem to really want something completely nutty as all of these properties jumping from one to anther, for no reason at all other than you want it.

So why? Why do you want it?