D&D 5E (2024) The Undead Army Necromancer is not Designable

[FrogReaver]

Necromancer fans have to accept that like in fiction, the undead army is a swarm and 1 unit.

You don't control 10 skeletons, you control 1 mass of skeletons.

Then you aren’t giving them what they want. Thus the intractable problem.

 

[Minigiant]

Then you aren’t giving them what they want. Thus the intractable problem.

Thats not the problem.

The problem is getting fans to say what they want to do with 10 skeletons.

If the answer is to take 10 turns then the responses no you can't do that.

If the answer is to make 10 attacks then the response is to make a single monster that has 10 attacks.

If the answer is to have 10 monsters to move around then the response is still monsters can't attack or interact with anybody and are passive body blockers.

If the answer is it's too crazy horde of Undead that enemies have to slow through then the response is that they get a swarm of Undead that represents the entire mob.

But no, you can't have 10 20 30 skeletons that you move around as a turn individually just for the simulation in a party based game.

 

[mellored]

1 spell for a blob of
1 spell for big
1 spell for shoot
1 spell for life drain

1 spell for utility. Warlocks can already get a skeletons as a familiar.

Also I don't see any reason why the swarm can't shoot. Maybe as a higher level thing, a Necromancer subclass thing, or such.

 

[FrogReaver]

Thats not the problem.

The problem is getting fans to say what they want to do with 10 skeletons.

That’s easy, they want to control 10 skeletons a turn entailing everything said 10 skeletons might do.

But no, you can't have 10 20 30 skeletons that you move around as a turn individually just for the simulation in a party based game.

Thus the intractable problem. You aren’t giving them what they want. You are demanding they give up on getting what they want in the name of gameplay.

 

[Minigiant]

1 spell for utility. Warlocks can already get a skeletons as a familiar.

Also I don't see any reason why the swarm can't shoot. Maybe as a higher level thing, a Necromancer subclass thing, or such.

I was going for Diablo 2 necromancer.

So instead of iron Maiden, Blood Golem, Skeleton Mage, Bone Spear.

Life Tap, Iron Golem, Skeleton Mage, Bone Spear.

I play most of the preNerf Necros

Corpse explosion Amp Dam
Poison Dagger
Skellymancer
Shotgun of Teeth

 

[DavyGreenwind]

I'd say not only is it designable, but it is designed. I would take a look at Mage Hand Press's Necromancer Class. The thralls have a combined CR cap, and collectively share one reaction and one bonus action. You can put them in a weird little bag of holding just for thralls. I think it's the closest anyone has gotten...

Necromancer | Base Class - Mage Hand Press

Command a horde of undead with the Necromancer base class for 5E 2024! Bend death to your will and rise to ultimate lichdom!

magehandpress.com

 

[Minigiant]

Thus the intractable problem. You aren’t giving them what they want. You are demanding they give up on getting what they want in the name of gameplay

I'm asking what specific what they want and are willing to give up.

My response with any spell that a person is not willing to give up anything in order to get the effect..

9th level spell.

 

[FrogReaver]

I'm asking what specific what they want and are willing to give up.

My response with any spell that a person is not willing to give up anything in order to get the effect..

9th level spell.

Again not what they want. You’re demonstrating this is an intractable problem.

 

[Remathilis]

Have you never played Diablo and it's family of computer games? Because the Necromancer class does not work like that.

Diablo can do that because it's a video game and primarily played solo. The game can track the doings of a dozen minions without the player having to make them do something individually every six seconds.

As a counter-example: The Elder Scrolls Online has a necromancer class and has a very limited selection of "pets". There is blastbones, basically a skeleton-guided missile, skeletal minion, a short lived ranged attacking skeleton (akin to summon undead in D&D) and spirit mender, a ghost who follows you and heals/protects you for a while. None are permanent pets (and ESO does have two classes with permanent pets). The rest of their kit involves flaming skulls, grasping skeletal hands, and conjuring tombstones.

Its very possible to viable a necromancer who doesn't walk around with a permanent army.

 

[mellored]

That’s easy, they want to control 10 skeletons a turn entailing everything said 10 skeletons might do.

Who is this thread is "they"?
Let them speak for themselves.

If you want 10 individual skeletons, go ahead and like this post so we can get a count.