Two stats per defense!

[Ravingdork]

The +13 is already included in the posted stat modifiers.

So where is the +8 coming from?

 

[Szatany]

So where is the +8 coming from?

Probably elite, perhaps some from elite and some from soldier* monster roles.

* IIRC

 

[The Little Raven]

So where is the +8 coming from?

Well, they've said that there's a table (or something) that lists values by level for the monster roles, so it's entirely possible that at level 26, a soldier gets a +8 bonus to attack above and beyond normal level-based bonuses (1/2 level).

 

[Stalker0]

Well, they've said that there's a table (or something) that lists values by level for the monster roles, so it's entirely possible that at level 26, a soldier gets a +8 bonus to attack above and beyond normal level-based bonuses (1/2 level).

The +8 is made up.

Remember, the designers have said repeatedly that monsters don't follow a formula. The designers give them numbers in order to provide a good challenge. The Pit Fiend's attack bonus is as powerful as plot

 

[Stogoe]

The +8 is made up.

Remember, the designers have said repeatedly that monsters don't follow a formula. The designers give them numbers in order to provide a good challenge. The Pit Fiend's attack bonus is as powerful as plot

That doesn't also mean there isn't a chart with "Hey, a +8 works as a good number for level 26 soldiers, and a +X works as a good number for level Y skirmishers, etc."

 

[maggot]

The +8 is made up.

Remember, the designers have said repeatedly that monsters don't follow a formula. The designers give them numbers in order to provide a good challenge. The Pit Fiend's attack bonus is as powerful as plot

The monster's I seen all have an extra defense bonus equal to (level/3) rounded down. In the Pit Fiend's case, it is +8. My impression is that this is to offset item bonuses that characters get. If PCs are expected to get (level/3) in item bonuses on attacks, it would make sense for monsters to have (level/3) bonus to defense to offset. Mearls said it would be trivially easy to remove items and just assign the attack bonus to characters as an extra bonus. (level/3) would be trivially easy in my book.

 

[DMShoe]

Or deliberately vague wording...

Deliberately vague? Me? Quite probably!

Generally, I'm letting you guys experience the thrill of discovery. It's much more gratifying to you to uncover the answer through deduction than if I simply tell you outright. Really. Even if you feel like throwing your mouse at your screen right now.

The info coming from D&D Experience will give you a good estimation of the way that defenses work, for both PCs and Monsters, since each follows its own set of rules. But as noted earlier, it's true that the better of an ability score "pair" is what applies to the respective defense. The rest of the bonuses are going to be class, race, feat, or other bonus types.

Even more data points can be gleaned from the variety of stat blocks on the Dungeons of Dread stat cards that'll be floating around --- that's 60 new monsters worth of stat blocks to add to your kobold-skirmisher stocked dungeon. At least, those stats are close enough, since many of the monsters and some of the math have undergone some subtle changes in the past few months.

 

[Mr Jack]

How does it make sense? I can (almost) get the strength relating to fortitude defenses, and the charisma on will defenses, but how on earth do you justify Int for reflex defenses (other than "game balance").'

Int as reflex save seems the most natural of the lot to me. Quick wits being equal to quick hands.

 

[Keenath]

Int as reflex save seems the most natural of the lot to me. Quick wits being equal to quick hands.

"You fight like a milkmaid!"
"How appropriate; you fight like a cow."

 

[Fifth Element]

How does it make sense? I can (almost) get the strength relating to fortitude defenses, and the charisma on will defenses, but how on earth do you justify Int for reflex defenses (other than "game balance").'

Well, we could check the text for the Insightful Reflexes feat from Complete Adventurer, since that allows you to use your Int modifier for Reflex saves:

"Your keen intellect allows you an uncanny knack for evading dangerous effects."

Okay, who wrote that crap? That's terrible.

Anyway, here's the explanation. Someone who relies on their Int for Reflex defence is all about reading situations and anticipation. You deduce what the enemy is going to try next, so you're ready for them when they do it. Someone who relies on their Dex is all about reaction. You don't anticipate, but you react with great speed. It's really quite simple.