Ultimate Magus, Arcane Hierophant, or Cerbromancer?

[Fallenibilis]

Im going to be starting a new campaign and i wanted to for the first time play a full caster up till now i have only played a rouge/duskblade, and a archivist/duskblade... Origianly i wanted to play a wizard/sorcerer or beguiler i had a story for him and everything but then i started looking in to other classes and the arcanehirophant really intrieguged me, and them my DM told us he was including Psionics for the first time and potential of a wizard psion screamed out at me. So i got three pathes i could take but im not sure which way to go wo i was hoping some one would be able to point out the pro and cons to each class.

Thanks

 

[Malachei]

Depends on your character's story, really.

An elf druid can be a great base for an arcane hierophant.

Of course, I'd prefer the Ultimate Magus any day. I like the idea of a sorcerer getting academy training, and the ability to fuel metamagic with spell slots from the other class is just amazing. Still, even with practiced spellcaster, you'll be two levels behind (but have a great caster level at the same time) -- by level 20, assuming you continue a full wizard caster level progression, this will mean spells per day as wizard 18 instead of 20, costing you two 9th level, one 8th level and one 7th level spell slot. The spells known and per day of a 9th level sorcerer (at caster level 17 -- with practiced spellcaster and UM spell power), the ability to apply metamagic with those spell slots, and the increase in spells known, as well as a wizard caster level of 22 (just UM spell power, without second practiced spellcaster) are worth it, IMO.

 

[Dandu]

Best UM build? Probably starts off with Wizard/Beguiler.

Sorcerors don't have much synergy with the wizard, unlike the Beguiler.

Sorcerers going into Mage of the Arcane Order is how I like to pull of a formally schooled sorcerer.

 

[Malachei]

I agree that Beguiler has a fine spell list and nice synergy with UM (or wizard, or any other INT-based spellcasting class), because INT-based casting reduces MAD. But many of the class benefits do not come into play: the beguiler is balanced against other classes with his spellcasting, plus 1d6 hit die, a fine skill list, the ability to wear armor, and several other level-dependent abilities (metamagic feats like silent, still spell, cloaked casting, etc.) -- as only your spellcasting ability rises in level once you join UM, the only beguiler abilities a typical UM (i.e. beguiler 1, wizard 4, UM X) would get are armored mage and trapfinding. I don't like the armored mage flavor-wise, especially for an UM, but most importantly, it applies only to beguiler spells, not to spells you cast from other classes. Not good.

On the other hand, if you're going UM, you'd probably want to be a specialist, maybe a focused specialist. In that case, the wider spell list a sorcerer offers can help you to tailor the character's spell list and offset the restrictions you are facing in your wizard casting. If you have dropped evocation as your first school, as many suggest, the beguiler's spell list will not be a big help. That also implies the use of spell trigger items -- as a sorcerer-based UM, you can easily grab that wand of maximized magic missiles from the treasure and shoot. Myself, I'd go for the sorcerer. Unless, of course, you mainly use your spontaneous caster spell slots for metamagic.

 

[Dandu]

Relevant link is relevant.

 

[pawsplay]

Really, for pure chewing satisfaction, an UM should pick a specialized caster such as Beguiler or Warmage, then specialize as a wizard, giving up the related domains.

However, if you find that clunky and weird, and I do unless the concept really calls for it, straight up wizard/sorcerer is strong enough and offers unparalleled flexibility. You still have every reason to specialize as a wizard, though.

 

[rgard]

Im going to be starting a new campaign and i wanted to for the first time play a full caster up till now i have only played a rouge/duskblade, and a archivist/duskblade... Origianly i wanted to play a wizard/sorcerer or beguiler i had a story for him and everything but then i started looking in to other classes and the arcanehirophant really intrieguged me, and them my DM told us he was including Psionics for the first time and potential of a wizard psion screamed out at me. So i got three pathes i could take but im not sure which way to go wo i was hoping some one would be able to point out the pro and cons to each class.

Thanks

All the dual casting PrCs are fun to me.

I played an AH, but used the UA variant where you dropped wildshape for a wisdom bonus to AC. Wasn't the most powerful build ever. The animal companion/familiar was a horse.

My favorite of all time is Duskblade 1/Wizard 5/Ur-Priest 2/Mystic Theurge 8/Arcane PrC 4 for the first 20 levels then Duskblade 2/Ultimate Magus in Epic.

I still have characters from 1E I never got around to converting to 3.5. One was a Magic User with psionics. I would convert the class to Wizard/Psion/Cerebremancer, but like the MT the Cerebremancer isn't as strong (level features) as the later the later dual casting PrCs.

What I posted over in the Giants forum:

"Hi All,

First post here. For a gish-like UM build you could do:

Duskblade 3, Wizard 3, Spellsword 1 (at some point in the build), UM 10, Abjurant Champion 5.

You can vary the levels of Duskblade and Wizard depending on your taste, but I always like Duskblade 3 to get the Arcane Channelling.

The Spellsword level gets you the reduction in ASF, 1 level of spell casting and 1 BAB.

Dandu posted the link to this thread over on ENWorld which led me here. Thank you, Dandu.

Thanks,
Rich"