Use Rope Useless?

[soulforge]

Why would anyone want to take Use Rope? I want to make it a skill that has uses the PC's might use. Even w/ a grappling hook at the highest DC to snare a PC could take 20 doing so. The only reason that seems remotely plausible is to allow player's to bind others, but that is replaced by buying manacles..

If I am right and it is useless, any ideas on how to make it decent?

 

[reason]

...

The problem is more that GMs tend to allow players to get away with doing things and providing answers that actually require some specialized knowledge of rope. e.g. how thick to support a man, or a man in armor on that cliff? Is the rope safe or rotten? How about in the rain? How about made of hemp, or hair? What sort of knots to use in circumstance X? If you personally can't answer or can't perform a task involving rope, then rope use checks are probably called for.

Reason
Principia Infecta

 

[Starglim]

In many situations requiring a grappling hook, taking 20 is not the best idea, such as scaling castle walls with orcs at the top. The synergy bonuses are useful. If you can find some lasso rules it's not a bad weapon at all. I've run into several game situations that required rigging ropes for a heavy lifting effort, or tying objects securely on a wagon.

But in general, it might help to think of it as a Profession skill after the first few levels.

 

[RichGreen]

Hi,

This usually comes up in our games when the PCs are tying up prisoners. No one has the skill and quite often the prisoners are able to escape.


Cheers


Richard

 

[Capellan]

Because ropes make climb checks easier, and you need to know how to tie a rope to use one for climbing

 

[Piratecat]

Because ropes make climb checks easier, and you need to know how to tie a rope to use one for climbing

I'd probably combine it with climbing or survival. It's one of those skills like read lips was, which really doesn't need to be its own beast.

 

[Psychic Warrior]

Yes Use Rope is useless. The only player I have seen waste ranks on it was a human Ranger with 16 INT (he had ranks to waste). I like the idea of combining it with another skill. I think Sleight of Hand might be a better choice though than Climb or Survival since it keeps it a DEX check (which it should be) but on the other hand more than the Rogue and Bard should have access to it. Hmmmm. is it possible to have a skill based off of 2 ability scores, taking the average bonus?

 

[Numion]

It is mostly useless, but when you do need it, it's pretty important. For prisoners, naturally. And nobody has it, of course.

I've got manacles on my new character, no need for use rope

 

[Storyteller01]

There's an OGL feat that allows you to use the Use Rope skill with a spiked chain while grappling. Basically, your tying them up (go cowboy!!). They have to beat your Rope Use roll with an Escape Artist or remain pinned for the round (so you can move on to other bad guys). Don't see why you can't do the same with a rope or lasso (cowboys use this trick on bulls all the time, and said bulls can still kick[grapple]). If you have Improved Trip, you can use the AoO froma trip to go straight into a grapple...

Also, if I understand the rules, anyone tied up (and without weapons on hand) would have to make an opposed escape artist check against your rope use check. What is the DC to escape manacles? Can a skill check get higher results?

Theives use it to secure ropes or rappelling. Military requires you to go to a repel master's course before your allowed to tie knots that others will be using. Anyone hauling cargo (sailors, truckers, etc) are adept at tying down their shipments so it doesn't move. While these guys ARE good at sleight of hand (at least the ones I know...), the skills were not comparable.

Not to mention the classic theif's repel knot. You tie the rope to a pole or other secure location, then throw the two ends down to the ground (the knot is tied near the center of the rope). One end will support your weight, while pulling on the other end releases the knot, allowing instant rope retrieval...


If you feel evil, use the Rope Use skill with wet leather or silk. The opponent's tied in this will have their Escape Artist check increase every round, since these materials shink as they dry (this is one of the ways Japanese managed to tighten the silk wraps on katana grips). Tjis trick can even cause minor damage...

If your feeling native american, slip said leather between the opponents achille's tendon and the rest of the leg (rather gruesome...)

 

[Psychic Warrior]

There's an OGL feat that allows you to use the Use Rope skill with a spiked chain while grappling. Basically, your tying them up (go cowboy!!). They have to beat your Rope Use roll with an Escape Artist or remain pinned for the round (so you can move on to other bad guys). Don't see why you can't do the same with a rope or lasso (cowboys use this trick on bulls all the time, and said bulls can still kick[grapple])

Also, if I understand the rules, anyone tied up (and without weapons on hand) would have to make an opposed escape artist check against your rope use check. What is the DC to escape manacles? Can a skill check get higher results?

Manacles vary from DC 30 to 35 to use escape artist to slip free. While it is possible to get a higher result with a Use Rope check I think the manacles are pretty tough. Also you can add a lock to the manacles making the DC (to pick them at least) even higher.

Theives use it to secure ropes or rappelling. Military requires you to go to a repel master's course before your allowed to tie knots that others will be using. Anyone hauling cargo (sailors, truckers, etc) are adept at tying down their shipments so it doesn't move. While these guys ARE good at sleight of hand (at least the ones I know...), the skills were not comparable.

Not to mention the classic theif's repel knot. You tie the rope to a pole or other secure location, then throw the two ends down to the ground (the knot is tied near the center of the rope). One end will support your weight, while pulling on the other end releases the knot, allowing instant rope retrieval...

Again though does this really require an entirely different skill to use? Considerign the relatively few skill point characters are allotted a seperate skill for using rope seems very redundant.