Using, misusing, and releasing OGC

[Orcus]

If I were a cynical person, I could read that as espousing an extant "old-boys" network. Together, the OGL and d20 licenses make everyone equal (in the eyes of WoTC, of course). Perhaps you feel (a la Animal Farm) that by dint of your previous hard work and efforts you should be just a little more equal than everyone else?

Wow. Clever. I always love the "If I were..."-and-then-go-on-to-post-what-you-say-you-arent argument. Thats a good one.

I dont think you have any idea what you are talking about, do you.

This isnt an old boys network. For god's sake I am proof of that. I came out of nowhere. Anyone can join. All I ask is that people respect the fact that there should be collegiality. Come on in, just play nice like everyone else.

Like I said, the "industry" existed before d20 and open gaming and it will exist after it. That is why you see collegiality amoung all smart companies. Upstart d20s will come and go. And if they are rude in the process, they wont care. But d20 wont last forever. And other people will care.

I can see you just want to bait an argument possibly to create some self-percieved importance for yourself. I've stated my comments.

Enjoy the mental masturbation of having all your opinions, untainted by the actual experience of actually having done anything.

Clark

 

[Monte At Home]

It's good that there is a kind of "guild-brother" mentality at work in this arena, but it's time to look beyond that. Whether you want to see me as a harbinger of change or a snake in the garden is up to you.

If it's up to me, basing my decision on a foundation courtesy, friendliness and a spirit of camaraderie versus, well, the opposite of those things, I guess I'll choose snake.

 

[NemesisPress]

I always love the "If I were..."-and-then-go-on-to-post-what-you-say-you-arent argument. Thats a good one.

Actually, it's more of a "devil's advocate" approach in order to get you (and our dear readers, if they've followed our tale this far) to think about some of the unstated assumptions underlying your position. I'm sure that you really believe the moral imperative of your position, but then again so did [fill in your favorite historical fall-guy here].

However, the flip-side of that has some validity perhaps. Should an established company be able to protect its market?

I can see you just want to bait an argument possibly to create some self-percieved importance for yourself.

Well, I'd judge the import of an argument (not necessarily its validity mind you) in both the measure of those who respond to it (transfixed, as it were, by its sultry, smoky flame), and the depth of the feeling it engenders in them.

The purpose {of the OGL} SPECIFICALLY is to allow third parties to produce support material that is not profitable for WotC to produce, thus driving the core product. It isnt a way to make small companies competitive at all. There are small companies that put out crap and are not competitive and big ones that dont, and vice versa. The license didnt make small companies competitive.

Quality is a separate issue. The point is that without the OGL and d20 licenses small companies would not even have the opportunity to compete since they could never hope to afford a negotiated license. (I should have phrased it that way the first time; thanks for pointing out the obvious misinterpretation.) Where I can see the tension arising is that this situation allows "bedroom publishers" to compete on a much better level with larger, established companies (the names of which elude me right now for some reason) in courting WoTC's sloppy seconds.


Now to get back to my original question after this rather long and utlimately unsatisfying sidetrack: Does anyone have any (positive) suggestions on how to best make use of OGC in their products - either OGC they are incorporating or OGC that they are releasing?

 

[Orcus]

Well I think that about speaks for itself...

Clark

 

[NemesisPress]

If it's up to me, basing my decision on a foundation courtesy, friendliness and a spirit of camaraderie versus, well, the opposite of those things, I guess I'll choose snake.

For the benefit of other latecomers, I'll just note that I don't have anything against courtesy, friendliness, and camaraderie (well, to be honest, I've never really cared for cameraderie that much) - just as long as it doesn't imply membership in a closed club and blind obedience to their unstated assumptions. (Plus I have a tough time remembering secret handshakes.)

The only thing I've said is that releasing content as OGC already constitutes the giving of blanket permission to use it without any restrictions whatsoever. To try to circumvent that - by any means, formal or informal (even under the guise of "courtesy") - is a perversion of the entire process. (And anyone so engaged should be ashamed!)

(But as pointed out, I'm not a lawyer - and rather proud of that fact.)

I further went on to say that thanking a creator for releasing OGC would be my definition of "courteous," and - most importantly - providing clear and detailed attribution of the source of the OGC (over and above what is required by the OGL) should always be carried out (since that is the essence of what OGC is all about).

 

[Morrus]

Incidentally - when is your first product coming out? What is it? When will you have a company website?

 

[Khan the Warlord]

Incidentally - when is your first product coming out? What is it? When will you have a company website?

Ouch.

"Incidentally" -- I like that subtle approach, dear Morrus.

Oh, and Mr. Kantor: After reading your posts and bearing witness to your obviously sarcastic, holier-than-thou words to a couple of respected d20/RPG industry professionals -- I have no desire to purchase a single product from "Nemesis Press", nor do I ever expect to in the future.

It is really sweet seeing an aspiring publisher desiring to slit his own throat by attempting to tackle Morrus and Clark needlessly. I especially enjoyed reading your cold words regarding your planned usage of OGC from other publishers.

Good job!

 

[NemesisPress]

I could certainly answer that. But what relevance does it have to this discussion? I started this thread (as a new d20 publisher) because I hoped for some constructive advice from established ones. (And so far, all I've gotten is a misapplication of the OGL.) I'm sure that a lot of readers of this thread are in exactly the same situation.

So don't think of me as Nemesis Press. Think of me as the voice of "every d20 publisher to be." (Or the ghost of Christmas Future or whatever.)

 

[Morrus]

I could certainly answer that.

OK, go on then. After all, you'll probably have to tell me sometime. You can't keep it a secret.

But what relevance does it have to this discussion?

None. So?

I started this thread (as a new d20 publisher) because I hoped for some constructive advice from established ones.

No you didn't.

 

[Khan the Warlord]

I could certainly answer that. But what relevance does it have to this discussion? I started this thread (as a new d20 publisher) because I hoped for some constructive advice from established ones. (And so far, all I've gotten is a misapplication of the OGL.) I'm sure that a lot of readers of this thread are in exactly the same situation.

I believe that you may have intended this thread in this manner, but once you met viewpoints that weren't quite your own, you quickly attempted to gain the written "upper hand", and not in a rather rude attempt.

So don't think of me as Nemesis Press.

You include a snippet about your "company" in your sig -- why shouldn't I consider your own words as the words of Nemesis Press?

Think of me as the voice of "every d20 publisher to be." (Or the ghost of Christmas Future or whatever.)

Hmm... I really don't see you as that voice, nor the ghost of Christmas Future... but I think "ghost" will have special meaning in your d20 future.