Weapon Finesse, does Dex add to damage?

[Darklone]

Well, if you like to have a huge majority superior elven or halfling fighters in your group... go ahead

There wouldn't be orcs, humans nor dwarves though anymore in your world They lost the last few wars.

 

[DM_Matt]

If you want a finesse fighter who is not way behind on dmg, use the Swashbuckler from Complete Warrior. They get WF for free at first level and they get Int instead of Str to dmg at 3rd. It still requires two separate stats, but it makes you competitive with high-str fighters without requiring the high str. Its a pretty cool class to keep taking, but at that point you could go any combination of one or more classes such as more swashbuckler, rogue, or, fighter.

 

[Coredump]

I've got a Rgr/Rog player in my game who is ripping through
things with his daggers. (aiming for the Jack of Knives Ledgendary
Class in a few levels)

What book is Jack of Knives out of?

Also, your player may want to check out Invisible Blade and/or Master Thrower from the Complete warrior.

Sonofapreacherman created them, but his original was a 10 level that combined them. (It is still on his website in the original form)

Oh, there was errata on the IB requirements. The only feats are WFocus and WFinesse.

 

[cnath.rm]

What book is Jack of Knives out of?

It's from the Path of Shadow book from Fantasy Flight Games, I
don't have the actual book, just the Mastercraft Anthology book
they put out as samples from 10 of their books. (but would like
to snag the full book at some point.)

 

[ergeheilalt]

Example: Halfling fighter. Already better with Power Attack in case he has a Finessed Spiked Chain (twohanded weapon, +2 to hit vs. a human due to dex and size). Now... give him his dex bonus extra on damage (or even instead of his strength damage). He'll have easily more damage than any human WITH Weapon Specialisation. For two feats.

What would you say if a finessed weapon/improved finess (ie: Dex to damage) was incompatable with power attack. It would make logical sense - power attack relies on brut force - it shouldn't work with a slick and stab Pirouette.

 

[Shadowdweller]

Since most finessable weapons are LIGHT weapons, power attack already does not apply to them.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Example: Halfling fighter. Already better with Power Attack in case he has a Finessed Spiked Chain (twohanded weapon, +2 to hit vs. a human due to dex and size). Now... give him his dex bonus extra on damage (or even instead of his strength damage). He'll have easily more damage than any human WITH Weapon Specialisation. For two feats.

Not a good example since you need 13 Str for power attack, and with the halfling racial adjustment that means a 15 Str before adjustments paid for.

You don't see many power attacking halflings unless they are *really* focussed on their strength.

 

[Darklone]

Dang, right. So, we only have a str 13, dex 20 halfling against a Str 18, dex 15 human.

With Weapon Finesse and Power Attack, the halfling is two feats behind a human (with only Power Attack), both need Exo Weapon prof... Sure, the Spiked Chain is a feat expensive weapon.

Now, what about elven fighter wizards?

 

[Tilla the Hun (work)]

Dang, right. So, we only have a str 13, dex 20 halfling against a Str 18, dex 15 human.

With Weapon Finesse and Power Attack, the halfling is two feats behind a human (with only Power Attack), both need Exo Weapon prof... Sure, the Spiked Chain is a feat expensive weapon.

Now, what about elven fighter wizards?

::sigh:: third time I've seen this discussion or one similar enought to it to make no nevermind


Consider three characters for a minute, created with identical stats, modified by race:

Human: Strength 14, Dex 14
H-Orc: Strength 16, Dex 14
Halfling: Strength 12, Dex 16


Now, all other things being equal, how does the weapon finessed halfling deal more damage than the power attacking H-orc? Also note that both of them have an advantage over the human, either more damage or more hits.

Add in the extra feat where the halfling can add his dex instead of str for damage (but notice, it's ONLY dex, not 1.5) and the halfling matches the H-Orc for any light weapons... or one-handed. 2-Handed weapons, the H-orc still does more damage, but not as many hits.

Elven fighter wizards shoot themselves in the foot for any medium or long term campaign with even multi-classing.

Off balance levels (1/9, 2/8) yield better returns, but now you're short on feats and HP. Anything more balanced and you're impacting on your spell capability, both highest possible spell and spells per day. Thus, fighter/wizard is not going to be worried about maximizing either damage or hits - at least not through fighter feats.

Right?

 

[James McMurray]

Now, all other things being equal, how does the weapon finessed halfling deal more damage than the power attacking H-orc? Also note that both of them have an advantage over the human, either more damage or more hits.

He puts one more point into strength and gets power attack himself, then couples it with the dex to damage feat?