Well that didn't take long, wizard has been shelved.

[darkadelphia]

Personally, I don't know why we have to keep discussing the assertion that wizards suck because they're not strikers. Wizards do something different than strikers--if you want to fling spells and do damage, play a warlock. If, in 3.5, you appreciated the beautiful thing that Glitterdust was, play a 4e Wizard.

 

[Mistwell]

Blame the dice. Then use munchkin masterwork dice.

Personally, I hate dice. They have something against me.
That's why I prefer auto damage whenever possible.
Flaming sphere FTW.

Your dice sent me an email last night. They hate you too. Except your d12. He's fine with you, because most of the time you leave him alone and he leaves you alone. But your d20, yeah, he hates you. And boy does he have a mouth on him! Yeesh, I wonder where he learned that language...

 

[Kesh]

edit: is there any way i can get this to NOT imbed? I kinda just want to link to it with descriptive text so you know what it is and not imbed it and its very annoying when everything i try for code either doesn't parse or imbeds.

Linking leads to Rickrolling.
Rickrolling leads to anger.
Anger leads to hate.
Hate leads to suffering.

 

[Sadrik]

It sounds like I have pretty much the same wizard: 18 Int, MM, Scorching Burst and Thunderwave as my at-wills. I'm having no problems slaughtering kobolds.

You must not need to throw your dice out.

If Nail is right in that they want us to have a 50% chance to hit levels 1-30, I am playing the wrong game.

As an example since we are talking about wizards, in the previous edition a wizard with an 18 INT shoots off his first level spell with a DC of 15, most monsters of that level had a pretty good FORT save (+3 needing to roll a 12+) but most of the time their REF and WILL were (-1 to +1 needing to roll a 14-16+) that means that the wizard and any spell user for that matter was going to have a much higher chance to "hit" with their spell. Now I dont know if those odds are right or not, it just is what was. Another upswing on this was that you did not feel like you had to absolutely max out your stat to be effective. I often ran a wizard with a 16 INT and gave him a high strength too. Now that is a pipe dream. With a maxed out stat I am hitting no more than 50% of the time. Is this math off? You decide.

 

[Sadrik]

Personally, I don't know why we have to keep discussing the assertion that wizards suck because they're not strikers. Wizards do something different than strikers--if you want to fling spells and do damage, play a warlock. If, in 3.5, you appreciated the beautiful thing that Glitterdust was, play a 4e Wizard.

Right, they suck get over it. Check.

 

[SweeneyTodd]

I think it's an understandable sentiment - Wizards used to be strikers (as well as a lot of other things), and if that was the thing about them you made the most use of, you may find a Warlock more suited.

Since I never really saw the 3.x warlock, I was fine going "Oh, they split the Wizard class up, got it", but others may not feel that way.

 

[Sadrik]

I think it's an understandable sentiment - Wizards used to be strikers (as well as a lot of other things), and if that was the thing about them you made the most use of, you may find a Warlock more suited.

Since I never really saw the 3.x warlock, I was fine going "Oh, they split the Wizard class up, got it", but others may not feel that way.

Interesting idea, making them a striker specializing in AoE. Maybe, I'll propose something like that to my DM.

We already agreed to add 1/2 level to damage and rolling a 50% retention on Dailies that miss. Giving the wizard an "Arcane Focus" for adding +1d6 damage to his spells just might be enough.

 

[darkadelphia]

Right, they suck get over it. Check.

Maybe you don't like it--personally, I'm fine with the refocusing. Wizards can't do everything anymore, but they retain the role that was unique from other classes. Personally, I was a little sick of every party being the wizard's bodyguards (even if Wizard was one of my favorite classes).

 

[Anthony Jackson]

Interesting idea, making them a striker specializing in AoE. Maybe, I'll propose something like that to my DM.

That's what the 'war wizard' build is.

We already agreed to add 1/2 level to damage and rolling a 50% retention on Dailies that miss. Giving the wizard an "Arcane Focus" for adding +1d6 damage to his spells just might be enough.

Actually, the changes you've already made are sufficient to render wizards overpowered; +1/2 level to damage is better than any striker ability in the game, and a roll to retain on dailies is pretty awesome too.

 

[Goumindong]

Are you saying you wish either Thunderwave or Ray of Frost attacked something other than Fort? I mean, that really comes off as whining.

*Sigh*

Look, some guy said "Ray of Frost and Thunderwave are awesome, i love having control on my at wills" and I said "Yea, its a shame they are both against fort though".

Which is the same as "Yea they are, it would be nice if one of them attacked something other than fort though" or "Yea, its a shame you can't take both of them without wondering where your paddle is when placid lake runs into creek" or "they would be even better if one of them didn't attack fortitude."