D&D 5E What are the "True Issues" with 5e?

[MichaelSomething]

And what wrong with wanting to just have a bunch of gold? I don't want to be one of those people who win the lottery and end up broke five years later. My character is saving their money for adventuring expenses (which I don't track but I know there're there!) and to fund a comfortable post adventure retirement.

 

[Lanefan]

The use is, very clearly, that things which do not conform to Earth-like situations are unacceptable. Unless something is explicitly magic--which almost always means spellcasting.

By no means is magic limited to spellcasting. Casting's only a minor-ish part of it in the big picture.

Martials can't cast spells but they can sure benefit from magic, usually by way of items that enhance their combat abilities. And if you take away the magic they can still fight, where if you take away the magic from a caster it likely hasn't got much else going for it.

Now, if the DM doesn't give out such items then maybe the martial really is hosed...but that'd be an unusual DM indeed.

 

[Mannahnin]

That assumes said Ranger has a bag of holding.

Which is cheap and easy to get in 5E if you use any sort of rules for buying magic items (like the Downtime rules in Xanathar's).

Also, last I checked arrows are sharp pointy little things - just the type of item one doesn't want to carelessly toss into one's BoH.....

...your players don't buy arrows in quivers? Wut.

 

[Lanefan]

I'm kind of boggled that folks role dice for commoners in 5e, or that the distribution of a 3d6 is taken as representative of the population distribution.

I only generate stats for a commoner if said stats for some reason become relevant in the moment e.g. it took damage and needs to make a Con-based check to stay upright or I need to know how strong it is for carrying-stuff purposes.

But yes, for Humans* I completely take the 3d6 bell curve and the 3-18 range as being representative of the population; on the assumption that if it wasn't we wouldn't use it (or a variant) to generate characters and instead would have and use something else that represented the population.

* - other species have their own ranges and bell-curves for each stat; the idea of those ranges and curves being representative of that species' population remains true, however.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

And what wrong with wanting to just have a bunch of gold? I don't want to be one of those people who win the lottery and end up broke five years later. My character is saving their money for adventuring expenses (which I don't track but I know there're there!) and to fund a comfortable post adventure retirement.

That's funny and all, but I think we'd find that if they compiled and clarified all the extant things to buy, and then added a few more things beyond just Plate Mail and Studded Leather that you can buy after character generation. And probably put prices on Magic Items, even though I suspect that most people would like them to avoid the idea that Magic Shops are everywhere, it's still a good idea for DM Guidance.

I mean, I personally like low-magic item games and loathe the 3e idea of Magic Shops Everywhere but even I wouldn't mind Magic Item Prices as a tool I can use to quick-judge how much I'm giving out. (Which would likely be on the low end of the scale, but it's still a useful tool).

Again, I don't think anyone is asking for massive system changes. Or if they are, that's not the point of this thread.

 

[Mannahnin]

I only generate stats for a commoner if said stats for some reason become relevant in the moment e.g. it took damage and needs to make a Con-based check to stay upright or I need to know how strong it is for carrying-stuff purposes.

But yes, for Humans* I completely take the 3d6 bell curve and the 3-18 range as being representative of the population; on the assumption that if it wasn't we wouldn't use it (or a variant) to generate characters and instead would have and use something else that represented the population.

* - other species have their own ranges and bell-curves for each stat; the idea of those ranges and curves being representative of that species' population remains true, however.

1 in 216 humans is as strong as the very strongest humans? 1 in 216 humans is at the very top of the IQ chart? 1 in 216 humans is as agile as an Olympic gold medalist gymnast?

Nah. Real human bell curves are a lot wider than 3d6 allows for. With much wider and narrow tails on the curve.

 

[mamba]

Trying to understand this. Are you saying that people solving problems that their class(niche) is designed to solve is an issue? If not, I'm still not understanding what you are trying to say.

Kinda, but not really… still looking for the right spin myself…

Obviously there are things one class is better at than another, that will never change and should not / cannot.

What I would like avoid is everyone but the player with the ‘obvious’ class disengaging from working on a solution because they (feel like they) cannot contribute anyway.
The problem still should favor some class(es), but it should not be unsolvable for the others, to the point that they are not even interested in trying.

What I am looking for is a more level playing field. As to how to accomplish that, the only choice seems to be by mostly bringing casters down a notch

I view it a bit different. Overly generous DMs who fill the spellbooks with tons and tons of spells create the problem where there wasn't one.

that works too, but we can help the inexperienced DM by addressing the issue at the root

 

[Lanefan]

You know..it really doesn't talk much about biology does it.

So acting like there is a biological justification for species' physical limitations is kinda nonsense isn't it?

And we do not have to accept that there is biological similarity that allows interbreeding..unless you plan to go ahead and make a case that celestials, fiends, and dragons all share this similarity.

That's exactly the case I make. Even though I don't have dragonborn, tieflings, etc. as playable species I do have justification for their (rare) existence baked into my setting: some dragons CAN interbreed with Humans, as can some demons and nearly all deities.

Long ago I took the various 1e monster manuals and, using the information and inferences given there, made up a whacking big chart of what can in theory interbreed with what. The very existence of Tabaxi, for example, indicates there is a biological bridge somewhere between Humans (or something similar) and felines (of some sort). Centaurs can in theory breed with both Humans and horses, another bridge. And on and on it goes.

I was quite amazed at the result.

 

[Lanefan]

Yeah, a lot of gamers seem to be deathly afraid of any bookkeeping.

And yet will happily take all day to level up their characters. I don't get it.

 

[Cadence]

1 in 216 humans is as strong as the very strongest humans? 1 in 216 humans is at the very top of the IQ chart?

1 in 216 humans is in the top 1/216 th though.

1 in 216 humans is as agile as an Olympic gold medalist gymnast?

It feels odd that everyone in a world would be able to be put into 16 buckets where it would be really hard to distinguish among those in it? Are most of the participants in the Olympics a 16-18 in the most relevant physical stat? Are they really only classifiable into three categories?

Nah. Real human bell curves are a lot wider than 3d6 allows for. With much wider and narrow tails on the curve.

They also aren't discrete and I would guess (for anything like carrying capacity) not much like a bell curve?