What do uncontrolled mindless undead do?

[wingsandsword]

You need a power outlet to plug that playstation in, and that won't be invented in your average D&D world for several centuries.

Which means it will be in Eberron by next year.

But back to the topic at hand, that's a big downside of using mindless undead as a workforce, they are destructive creatures of negative energy with little self-initiative that you're trying to put to constructive use. A little like finding peaceful uses for nuclear weapons, it's possible but it runs counter to the original idea behind the item.

The most creative use I ever saw for them in D&D was in Dark Sun, by placing groups of them in giant hollow wheels of war machines and ordering them to march forward, using them as an engine. That's probably the best use, as a simple engine that needs no food or water. Just lock them in an armored compartment of a war machine and they can pedal, pull, or march as needed to drive the dang thing. In a less militaristic sense, they could be great at turning mill wheels, or a group of them harnessed together pulling carts day & night over long, relatively straight roads (I presume you could steer them a little with proper harnesses, and the only command is "march forward", and you only needed a cleric to say "stop" and "go").

 

[Jack Simth]

All right... the caster level for a potion or oil is the minimum needed to cast the spell... oils and potions can take up to 3rd level spells... Animate Dead (for zombies/skeletons) is a 3rd level spell for clerics... so you should, in theory, be able to make an oil of Animate Dead, give it to the farmer, and he can use it to animate a body, and control up to 4*5=20 HD of undead, animating up to 2*5=10 HD of undead at a time.

Any holes?

 

[The_Fan]

Undead are a notable exception to the rule that mindless creatures do not have an alignment. While a giant scorpion may seem destructive and cruel, it's just following its instinct. A zombie or skeleton cannot make moral decisions, and yet it is evil. Its actions when not commanded would therefore have to reflect an overwhelming desire for evil as a hardwired instinct.

I see skeletons as behaving in an irrationally cruel manner, such as by tearing at someone's limbs first instead of going for a more immediate kill. It then may even stand around and watch the person struggle in agony without limbs, seeming to derive pleasure from its victim's torment like a child pulling the wings off an insect. However, it derives no pleasure from it, nothing at all. It just hurts people because that's what it does.

Zombies I see as wandering around in a mockery of life. The speak with dead spell implies that a corpse still carries some fragments of memory, even if it doesn't have the capacity to understand or act on it. A zombie, however, can act on it. A mother might push around an empty baby carriage, long after the wheels have fallen off and the cloth has rotted to ruin. An artist will paint the walls with whatever filth it can find, producing artwork only a madman or a Karnnathi would appreciate. A baker will place random things in the oven, maybe even other zombies. They don't understand or even wonder what they are doing or why, they are just going through the motions of life at a shuffling pace.

Both could possibly apply to either, that's just generally the way I picture it. I think you should make clear though that mindless undead without orders are not a pleasant thing at all.

 

[Tatsukun]

Well how about just saying that these undead are a little different? Maybe there's a big shrine to (god/goddess of death) in the town, so any undead made there act like constructs rather than undead.

If they leave the area, they revert to acting like constructs.

IIRC, constructs will just keep on doing what they are doing until they are told otherwise, and they can be controled by anyone.

You don't have to give them any more construct traits, just that one.

That works, I think.

-Tatsu

 

[LordSkull]

Will have to find my sources but I remember reading about lesser undead (Skeletons and Zombies) as being able to have control transfered to another person after creation and also continuing to follow their last given orders until new ones were given. (Will check this when my books and I are in the same zip code again)

Mage/Cleric #1 animates undead and commands it to follow Farmer #8's orders. As These creatures are tireless they can work all day and night thus requiring fewer workers to perform the same tasks as a living sleeping human would. Therefore farmer #8 may only require 1-5 undead workers as opposed to say 3-15 hired hands.

As for the control limit. Maybe a higher version of the undead spell or an artifact or magic item that allows more then the usual number of undead to be controled. Also if my memory has failed me could even have Pyramid like artifacts in each town or city that is used to control mass undead. Like a radio tower to keep them in line.

 

[boredgremlin]

Undead are a notable exception to the rule that mindless creatures do not have an alignment. While a giant scorpion may seem destructive and cruel, it's just following its instinct. A zombie or skeleton cannot make moral decisions, and yet it is evil. Its actions when not commanded would therefore have to reflect an overwhelming desire for evil as a hardwired instinct.

I see skeletons as behaving in an irrationally cruel manner, such as by tearing at someone's limbs first instead of going for a more immediate kill. It then may even stand around and watch the person struggle in agony without limbs, seeming to derive pleasure from its victim's torment like a child pulling the wings off an insect. However, it derives no pleasure from it, nothing at all. It just hurts people because that's what it does.

Zombies I see as wandering around in a mockery of life. The speak with dead spell implies that a corpse still carries some fragments of memory, even if it doesn't have the capacity to understand or act on it. A zombie, however, can act on it. A mother might push around an empty baby carriage, long after the wheels have fallen off and the cloth has rotted to ruin. An artist will paint the walls with whatever filth it can find, producing artwork only a madman or a Karnnathi would appreciate. A baker will place random things in the oven, maybe even other zombies. They don't understand or even wonder what they are doing or why, they are just going through the motions of life at a shuffling pace.

Both could possibly apply to either, that's just generally the way I picture it. I think you should make clear though that mindless undead without orders are not a pleasant thing at all.

I was gonna say they just go on a rampage but i like this way better. I am gonna implement this from now on. Thx.

Anyway i dont see farmer john, or bob the shepherd having fulltime zombie helpers. Probably something more like modern temp agencies run by spellcasters. Farmer john needs some help planting or clearing a new field so he goes to the temp agency and hires a few zombies and thier overseer for a couple days to do all the hard work. The cleric or mage who commands them comes with the cost. Probably even most of the cost.

On a side note i imagine skeletons being much more common for this sort of thing then zombies. Zombies would stink to high hell and be dropping rotten bits of themselves all over the place. Who wants that? Not to mention you can get twice the manpower out of skeletons at an increased work pace. HP wouldnt be that important in this. They arent fighting, they are planting seeds or harvesting crops. Ugh harvesting crops. Another good reason not to have zombies, who wants a bag of rotten flesh handling thier food? Nasty.

 

[ThirdWizard]

A mother might push around an empty baby carriage, long after the wheels have fallen off and the cloth has rotted to ruin. An artist will paint the walls with whatever filth it can find, producing artwork only a madman or a Karnnathi would appreciate. A baker will place random things in the oven, maybe even other zombies. They don't understand or even wonder what they are doing or why, they are just going through the motions of life at a shuffling pace.

YOINK! Genius, I'm totally using that.

 

[Alzrius]

Just wanted to add my voice to the chorus, as The_Fan's explanation was by far one of the most cogent and entertaining I've seen in reply to the question.

 

[LordSkull]

On a side note i imagine skeletons being much more common for this sort of thing then zombies. Zombies would stink to high hell and be dropping rotten bits of themselves all over the place. Who wants that? Not to mention you can get twice the manpower out of skeletons at an increased work pace. HP wouldnt be that important in this. They arent fighting, they are planting seeds or harvesting crops. Ugh harvesting crops. Another good reason not to have zombies, who wants a bag of rotten flesh handling thier food? Nasty.

Well actually farmers WOULD want zombies for the planting stage especially if bits of rotting flesh are falling all over the place. Think of the increased growth of the crops from that kind of fertilizer. Human flesh works just as well for growing things as any other flesh does. Now I would imagine a good polished Skeleton would be doing the harvesting and other tasks where bits of flesh are unwelcome. Imagine a zombie maid making more of a mess than it is cleaning up by leaving pieces of itself everywhere.

 

[the Jester]

Another thing to keep in mind is that using mindless undead for labor prolly requires considerably more supervision than using living laborers or even slaves. You can't give them complex commands, you always need to be watching for them doing mindlessly stupid things, etc.

The_Fan has a great view on this topic, btw.