What do you do beyond combat?

[Elder-Basilisk]

What to do beyond combat?

The old skool answer would be build a keep and eventually build a kingdom. Once you pacify one hex of the map, you garrison it and move on to eliminate dangers from the next hex so that your farmers can expand and you can tax them and build an army to defend it and eventually become a power in the world.

But really, if you've just done fighting until now, the fighting is a good place to start. What are you fighting for? If the answer is that you're fighting for truth, justice, and the Cormyrian (or Furyondian) way, then, starting with that motivation, you just need to ask, "what challenges truth, justice, and/or the Furyondian way that can't be solved with the point of a sword?" What if, for instance, some of the nobles who are not on the front lines of the Great Crusade against Iuz are growing rich by taking their tolls and taxes on trade to support King Belvor's war effort. In their wealth, they grow complacent and don't want to make the sacrifices necessary to win the war. After all, Iuz will be satisfied with Crockport for the moment--he's had enough of war for at least one lifetime and after that, they'll be dead so why do they care? How do the players deal with that? Or, maybe the king is growing old and is without an heir--several men are more or less equally qualified by right of blood but some are morally or mentally unfit for the job. That said, they have the money and connections that are necessary to secure it. What do the PCs do? Or maybe if your players aren't the kind who can think of schemes on their own, you can have the NPCs do some of the scheming for them. Powerful PCs would be valuable allies in the struggle for the throne so, perhaps the villains set about securing the PCs' aid through a strategic political marriage. On his way back from the dungeon, Fred fighter and Peter Paladin are met with an emissary from Duke Villainous offering the hand of his daughters in marriage with their considerable doweries and lands. The PCs have to meet the girls then and if the girls' natural charms aren't up to the task, charm and suggestion spells are always handy. If the PCs are oblivious to the political implications, you let them get up to the point where backing out will have painful consequences and then another NPC warns them of some of what is going on. Etc. etc.

In my recent campaign, I had one character who had assumed the name of a fallen knight and another PC who was the heir to a consequential earldom that had been usurped by his uncle (in secret alliance with the kingdom's enemies). In the last two sessions, the PCs were to be honored by the king for their role in rediscovering the mythical jade chapel. All well and good, but the false nobleman had to decide whether to come clean or try to keep up the charade in the presence of people who actually knew the dead knight whose identity he had assumed. The heir had to decide whether to continue incognito and accept the honors under his assumed identity or to declare himself publicly. If he declared himself publicly, of course, his uncle might try to have him assassinated or he might pretend to be glad that his nephew had returned and return to his lands to "prepare them for the new earl" but, when he got there, rebel and swear fealty to the kingdom's enemy. That would, of course lead to civil war and possibly a new war with the kingdom's enemy. Alternatively, he could accuse his uncle of crimes that the uncle would have to answer for before he left. The likely result of that would be a judicial duel. (And, unfortunately for him, his uncle was a better fighter than he was--and he knew it).

So, two characters out of six and it's already a massively complex scenario. Now, add the god (or God) in and it gets even more complex. Previously the heir character had accepted the offer of an unknown woman to remove a disease inflicted upon him by an evil priest so that he could get revenge on his uncle. So, she appeared to him again in a dream, offering her aid. He refused. Then the god that he claimed to worship sent him a dream where he could symbolically cast off her protection. If he did so, the disease would return. Secretly, however, he would also earn the favor of his god and would be under the effect of a clvl 9 Divine Favor spell in the duel. (In my campaign, the God or gods--or at least some of them--really do favor the just in judicial duels).

Making it a bit more complex, a mysterious stranger who was really an agent of the villainous kingdom offered another PC an undetectable poison which he was to place on the heir's sword before the duel--thereby helping his friend to win. Secretly, of course, he was planning on having the poison detected right before the duel and thereby causing the heir to be executed for treachery.

So, there's lots of conflict in that example but very little combat--only the judicial duel which was called off in the middle because the agents of the villainous kingdom took advantage of the duel to kidnap the queen and flee the citadel--but not before stabbing the uncle in the back to make it look like they were in league with the rightful heir.

 

[Varianor Abroad]

Ask your players what they might want to do besides combat. Take notes, and tell them you'll try it. Then see what works. (Which can be a long process.)

 

[Tinner]

The best way to find things to do other than combat is to look at real life.
Very few of us spend our lives engaging in combat.
We work, go to school, look for romance, go to church, make friends, make money, deal with family, relax, socialize, get involved in our communities, etc.

Translate some of these activities to your game.

What do the PC's do for work & income? Odds are this is adventuring, but it doesn't have to be, they could be traders, merchants, guards, etc.

Are the PC's learning new things? What wizard college is your Evoker training at?

The adventuring life is a lonely life. Maybe your bard should settle down with that barmaid. Maybe her father wants to MAKE him settle down with that barmaid! (That would be a longsword wedding, rather than a shotgun wedding of course.)

If you have a cleric in your party, what church does he attend? Is he ever called on to officiate weddings? Baptisms? Christenings? Funerals? Bless crops? Bless nobles?

What's going on in the adventurers home town? Any local fairs or festivals? Most medieval towns had some sort of holiday, whether a harvest festival, or a feast day, or even just a market day that allowed for socializing. There are tons of adventure opportunities at these events. Check out Natural 20's "Tournaments, Fairs & Taverns if you can find it. It's excellent for this sort of thing.

Of course all these activities will be easier to set up if your players have created rich backgrounds for their PC's. Bob the featurless barbarin is never going to have any reason to have a family or a socal calendar. If the players take an active role in fleshing out their PC's they will care more about them, and they will care more about these "mundane" actiities.

 

[DMH]

SOME rpgs are mostly combat rules? Which major ones aren't? I'd be interested to look into them. I think I heard that the Vampire ones just use rock/paper/scissors for combat, so I guess those. Ok I'll revise my statement to non-LARP rpgs. Seems to me the combat chapter (and its dependencies) is always the bulk of the book.

Fudge and Alternity come to mind. Both are generic systems- the latter has a sci-fi slant, but can be used for just about any non-superhero genre. Fudge you can download for free from Grey Ghost's website: http://www.fudgerpg.com/fudge.html Check out the bottom right of the page. http://alternityrpg.net is the official site for that game.

 

[Lela]

There aren't a lot of rules for non-combat because they aren't required. It's all talk.

As Tinner said, a lot of what makes the game real is doing real life things. It's adding a bit of fantasy to them that makes it a game. You'd be surprised how far you can push things before people realize they're in a soap opera.

As normal, falling in love with the cheerleader or princess won't do much to you. It's acting on it that has it's consiquinces. Here, at the most, you get beat up by her boyfriend. There, assuming you even have access to her, you deal with all those who have a stake in who she does, or doesn't, marry. From assasination and duels, to members of the court embarrassing you in public or openly trying to help you (better than that slimey roach of my rivil's loins). Introduce things slowly and it will get complicated very fast.

Another of my favorite things to do is take control of a random NPC (with my DM's support) while my character is off away from the party. I always make sure the character would be in a situation like that and I always try to advance the story and build the world while I'm doing it. By paying attention to the setting and culture of the party's location, I can drop myself in as a disgruntled aging cleric, desperate mother, or drunken bum. Each time, I try to advance a point of view that my character doesn't share (or doesn't care about) through babbling, argument, or preaching from atop a soap box.

Finally, I'd say the bluff/diplomacy skills are there for two reasons. First, to give gamers who aren't all that socially adaptive a chance to play a character who is. Second, to help give guidelines to those of us who can come up with flowing speaches on the fly. Playing a character who doesn't have a good Diplomacy? Dial it down, you're RPing. One who has a good Bluff? Toss a few lies into what you're saying now and then; see what you can do to keep it discreet. RPing to the character sheet. That's the hardest part about playing and the point of the whole experience.

 

[Agback]

After all, the rules for RPGs are almost entirely combat rules.

That's not quite true. The game I favour (ForeSight) has rules for combat, it's true. Also for sneaking and hiding, patrolling and counter-patrolling, lying, recognising lies, persuasion, resisting being persuaded, seduction, resisting being seduced, lock-picking, penetrating electronic security systems, hacking security on computer networks, long-distance travel, chase sequences, cross-country travel in different terrains, diagnosing and repairing damage to equipment, academic research, scientific research, design and construction, spaceships, space combat, falling, drowning, burns, poisons, radiation sickness, effects of exposure, wilderness survival, spaceship construction, space combat. James Bond 007[/i] has rles for seductions, gambling, chase sequences and most such Bondage. Space 1889 has rules for various activities in the wilderness exploration and SteamPunk science area. The original Call of Cthulhu had rules for library research and going mad. Steve Jaqckson's designs often have rules for getting and holding down a job. Bushido had rules for running a fief, temple, or school, founding a family, establishing a new religious sect, etc.

Many RPG rulesets are eavily dominated by combat rules. But there are definite exceptions.

 

[Crothian]

Beyond combat the characters live. Its like asking a person what do they do beyond eating, its seems like a silly question to me. THe characters travel, they shop, they rest, they enjoy themselves, they do what they want to. Combat is not what the game is about.

 

[der_kluge]

What troubles me here is that this is what *you* want to do. It's possible that your players are only interested in killing people and taking their stuff. Find out what they want to do, and then do that.

Playing a game lax on the combat side of things is great, and I prefer those kinds of games, but they do require players who are willing and able to participate in more role-playing centric encounters. If your players are the kind that are only interested in rolling dice, you might not be successful.

 

[Lela]

der_kluge has a good point. We had one player who decided to leave early at our last session because there wasn't any combat and none was in sight. The rest of us enjoyed that kind of session--so I believe it was okay--but he doesn't. Just not his game.

Now, that said, I can get into the combat side of things too; really enjoy it and pump out some interesting spells--which, using the magisty of EoM, I wrote myself. I encorage combat loving players to make some effort to enjoy the RP side of things.

 

[KenSeg]

I think it really comes down to the players and their characters. Some characters lend themselves to heroic quests and religious crusades (Paladins and clerics), while others are more about court intrigue or stealthy plotting (bards, rogues).

One thing that we have found has helped a good deal in shaping the campaign is the backgrounds and special abilities of our characters. Our DM created a character generator program long before they were common which included both good and bad characteristics. These might be some magical ability of one specific type such as the ability to charm with your gaze once a day or it might be that you have some divine blood in your background (granny got around). The bad characteristics were even better. You might be fleeing an affair, be hated by giant class or even have some of that demonic blood in your background (Granny got caught).

From these things, we created whole campaigns. A long quest to find a way to remove the demonic stain from the wizards soul or to uphold the interests of your divine grandfather or avoid the assassins seeking to kill you because granny was a serving maid to the duke and his heir doesn't like the competition.

All of these things lead to political intrigue, quests through ancient ruins filled with magical traps, saving of damsels or knights being held for sacrifice, etc. Combat with meaning. Not just for the gold or loot.

-KenSeg
-Gaming since 1978