What do YOU plan on doing with Daggerheart?

[Aldarc]

Daggerheart does have 77 games that it's offering at Gen Con. In contrast, Shadowdark has 69. I think that's pretty good for Daggerheart considering it just released less than three months ago.

 

[zakael19]

Daggerheart does have 77 games that it's offering at Gen Con. In contrast, Shadowdark has 69. I think that's pretty good for Daggerheart considering it just released less than three months ago.

Also considering that it's basically "what if everything you liked about 5e and Critical Role but different" vs a completely separate vibe and ruleset like Shadowdark.

After the juggernaut that is D&D, I've seen more games forming for Daggerheart in the local discord that spans the entire DC metro than any other ruleset currently; and they fill up fast. In the group I've put together, 3/4 of the players have gotten their hands on the books (I got the PDF). My online group which is switching to DH next has two preorder deluxe sets in hand.

I think pretty much any other non-public publisher would be extremely happy with the sell through of the game.

 

[wicked cool]

I’m judging i

It’s apples and oranges, really.

Shadowdark is an OSR game with underlying mechanics very similar to 5E but with changes to push things in a decidedly old-school direction. Anyone who’s run any OSR game or old-school D&D could run a passable Shadowdark game with a read of the book and whatever prep time they normally take for such a game. The quick character creation and high lethality make it great for one-shots and convention play. And there are about 50+ years worth of content you can mostly directly draw from. So it’s very easy to pick up and play.

Daggerheart is a Frankenstein of new and old that everyone will need time to adjust and learn to run it well. Even people who ran it during the open beta are having some trouble adjusting to the final release. To run Daggerheart well you need to either come from a PbtA or BitD background already or learn that style of play. That learning curve can be huge for people only used to D&D. Besides that, the game is focused on long-term OC play with the PCs as the protagonists. Character creation is slow and involved the entire group. This makes it especially bad for one-shots and convention play.

It’s like judging a monkey and a goldfish based on which is better at climbing a tree.

 

[wicked cool]

Sorry judging it by convention play/marketing etc. if you can’t plop it down and market it to a new audience then that’s a problem. If it’s not in stores it’s a problem. If it’s not being played in 2025 in flgs it’s probably a mess
It’s great that it’s selling wave 1
I’m not arguing on the quality of the game but it dollars are limited and so are attention Spans. It can be a blunder to oversell a product and not have enough marketing or presence.

 

[SteveC]

The hottest time is release. They don’t have enough books so for some it gets buried. There’s a new rpg coming out mcdm or something and if that company gets more books into more hands it wins.

Just a comment on this. There are a lot of games coming out or just released. Daggerheart has (in my opinion, obviously) shaken the whole release structure up. I haven't seen any mention of Cosmere (although Knights of Last Call are covering it) and that was a $15 million Kickstarter! Daggerheart production is racing along as fast as can be and I get the sense that it even surprised Darrington with the success (especially with the play test having some issues).

I would not want to be releasing a new product line in 2025. I think some really good games are going to get lost in the shuffle. For instance, I am a huge 13th Age fan and it is going to be hurt by this. And I think MCDM will be as well.

And that's all too bad. It's just that I really find Daggerheart to be a ton of fun, so it's hard for me to be too sad about it! If Daggerheart gets me back to playing in person, what a world that would be.

 

[zakael19]

Yeah like, speaking of marketing, the biggest name in TTRPG media is running a short campaign in it as we speak.

They're also doing some big stuff at GenCon apparently?

I haven't had the chance to play in a FLGS in ages, none close enough to be usable. I also run a couple hundred hours of games per year with folks. I'm not sure that FLGS shelves are a great marker of...marketing or exposure in the year of our lord 2025.

They're also in normal bookstores like Barnes and Nobles. I'm not sure many other TTRPGs that aren't D&D or PF2 get to say that.

 

[overgeeked]

They're also in normal bookstores like Barnes and Nobles. I'm not sure many other TTRPGs that aren't D&D or PF2 get to say that.

They’ve gotten better over the years. They had a few RPGs other than D&D and Call of Cthulhu ten years ago but have expanded the section since. At least those near me.