Level Up (A5E) [+] What features should a "Advanced 5E" have?

[Zaukrie]

Personally, I prefer the list of all D&D spells organize into themes, "domains", and both Wizards and Clerics have their spells restricted by which thematic domain they pick. Perhaps a Wizard normally picks two domains, while a Cleric normally one plus focusing on melee.

Agreed. I wish all spellcasters had restricted spell lists, but I know that PLAYERS hate that (until they actually play that way).

 

[Haldrik]

Agreed. I wish all spellcasters had restricted spell lists, but I know that PLAYERS hate that (until they actually play that way).

If a player can freely choose which domains the character gets, I dont see the problem.

 

[Zaukrie]

How about moving to 4e "always attacking".....so no DC saves on spells, but instead you roll an attack to see if your spell works? That's probably too divergent.....

 

[Haldrik]

How about moving to 4e "always attacking".....so no DC saves on spells, but instead you roll an attack to see if your spell works? That's probably too divergent.....

Attack only is supposed to be workable. The base 10 = d20.

The problem is the numbers are often precalculated and baked in, such as in the Monster Manual statblocks.

But attack only is part of normal 5e math.



If A5E leaves the math as bonuses only, then the DM/player can choose whether to add it to a 10 or a d20.

 

[Undrave]

If each culture is built out of a set backgrounds, then use the background to decide which language the character knows.

For example, instead of making sword and bow proficiencies an Elf race trait, make them two specific backgrounds that exist in a specific community in a specific culture, that a player can choose from. For example, one culture might have mandatory military service, and one military unit are sword dancers whose fighting style features gymnastic sword fighting techniques that allow the use of longsword as a finesse weapon and as a spellcasting focus. But the archery military unit is a different background.

As is apparent, it is the setting guide that defines which cultures exists, thus which backgrounds exist.

You could always go for more generic cultures and civilisation, like how the game 'Tapestry' doesn't have real life civilization but only generically themed ones: Militant, Isolationist, Nomad, Historian, Entertainer, Builders, Futurists, Inventor, Merrymaker, Traders, Mystics, The Chosen, Leaders, Alchemist, etc.

I think it would be possible to provide civilization building blocks... like to make a civilization or culture you first start with an environment (mountain stronghold, forest town, port city, desert oasis, farming village, etc) and then something we can call a 'virtue', like what the culture uses as the most important measure of success. You could have militant culture who value strength of arm, culture who value self-suficiency and grit, cultures who value religious devotion, other the accumulation of knowledge, mercantile acumen, crafting ability, magical talent, and so forth.

Smush them together, pick 1 main language and 3 secondary language from which characters can choose from and VOILA! You have your civilization with the benefits they give!

For exemple, you can say you come from a theocratic kingdom built around a desert oasis. You get +2 CON, because you are used to the desert heat, +1 INT because it's important to recall the tenet of the Faith, you gain proficiency in Religion (obviously) and Animal Handling (to ride Camels), you learn Common and you can pick between an equivalent to ancient latin, a language related to djinn and the draconic spoken by that one clan of nomadic Dragonborn that always come by the city.

Throw in the speed, vision and maybe a single physical ability from race (say that you're a Dwarf so you get the iron stomach of the race) and you got a solid replacement for race.

Throw in a background to represent your previous career (let's say, Soldier) and you can start picking your class.

 

[Haldrik]

You could always go for more generic cultures and civilisation, like how the game 'Tapestry' doesn't have real life civilization but only generically themed ones: Militant, Isolationist, Nomad, Historian, Entertainer, Builders, Futurists, Inventor, Merrymaker, Traders, Mystics, The Chosen, Leaders, Alchemist, etc.

I think it would be possible to provide civilization building blocks... like to make a civilization or culture you first start with an environment (mountain stronghold, forest town, port city, desert oasis, farming village, etc) and then something we can call a 'virtue', like what the culture uses as the most important measure of success. You could have militant culture who value strength of arm, culture who value self-suficiency and grit, cultures who value religious devotion, other the accumulation of knowledge, mercantile acumen, crafting ability, magical talent, and so forth.

Smush them together, pick 1 main language and 3 secondary language from which characters can choose from and VOILA! You have your civilization with the benefits they give!

For exemple, you can say you come from a theocratic kingdom built around a desert oasis. You get +2 CON, because you are used to the desert heat, +1 INT because it's important to recall the tenet of the Faith, you gain proficiency in Religion (obviously) and Animal Handling (to ride Camels), you learn Common and you can pick between an equivalent to ancient latin, a language related to djinn and the draconic spoken by that one clan of nomadic Dragonborn that always come by the city.

Throw in the speed, vision and maybe a single physical ability from race (say that you're a Dwarf so you get the iron stomach of the race) and you got a solid replacement for race.

Throw in a background to represent your previous career (let's say, Soldier) and you can start picking your class.

I am guessing the Players Handbook already has many "generic" backgrounds to choose from, plus basic how-to to customize a new background. A background includes several proficiencies (skills, tools, languages), plus a special non-combat asset. Ideal Flaw and Quirk also correspond the Background.

I am guessing this is good enough for anyone using the Forgotten Realms setting.



What a new setting or a DM tweaking can do is add more Backgrounds.

Each special asset can be finetuned to express an aspect of a distinictive cultural institution.

This asset can be a magical one − access to a ritual including an unusual ability unknown elsewhere.

Moreover, the proficiencies used for skill-tool-language can instead gain one martial weapon or cantrip, or minor ritual equivalent to a noncombat cantrip.

I am guessing two skill proficiencies equals one cantrip or martial weapon proficiency.

So a background can cover much ground to express a specific job in a specific culture.

 

[Haldrik]

I think it would be possible to provide civilization building blocks... like to make a civilization or culture you first start with an environment (mountain stronghold, forest town, port city, desert oasis, farming village, etc) and then something we can call a 'virtue', like what the culture uses as the most important measure of success. You could have militant culture who value strength of arm, culture who value self-suficiency and grit, cultures who value religious devotion, other the accumulation of knowledge, mercantile acumen, crafting ability, magical talent, and so forth.

Personally, I first start with what CLASSES are the most prominent for a specific locale in a specific culture.

Is it a culture or Wizards, Rangers, Rogues?

Then decide where they live. Floating castle, treehouse town, sea port.

Then decide where they are most likely to get their food.

From there, what kind of organizations do they form, what are their spiritual customs, and so on.

Magic makes anything possible, including any kind of utopia. So start with the classes and go from there.

 

[Kinematics]

Skipped a bunch of pages, but....

More crunch on social, yes. Take a look at Lace and Steel, which essentially has a full combat system in repartee. I'm not sure the same can be done for exploration, but it'd be an interesting exercise.

Though on the question of 'crunch', make sure that that doesn't mean "more modifiers that you have to account for on every single action". Going the direction of Pathfinder/PF2 would be a hard fail, to me.

On a personal level, strip out all spells that nullify the point of any other characters using their own skills. Reevaluate them carefully before adding them back in.

Movement in combat is mostly a failure. There's a reason 5E combat almost always devolves to "stand there and hit each other in the face until one of you fall down". This isn't an easy problem to solve, but it needs something.

 

[Zaukrie]

Skipped a bunch of pages, but....

More crunch on social, yes. Take a look at Lace and Steel, which essentially has a full combat system in repartee. I'm not sure the same can be done for exploration, but it'd be an interesting exercise.

Though on the question of 'crunch', make sure that that doesn't mean "more modifiers that you have to account for on every single action". Going the direction of Pathfinder/PF2 would be a hard fail, to me.

On a personal level, strip out all spells that nullify the point of any other characters using their own skills. Reevaluate them carefully before adding them back in.

Movement in combat is mostly a failure. There's a reason 5E combat almost always devolves to "stand there and hit each other in the face until one of you fall down". This isn't an easy problem to solve, but it needs something.

I agree on the fiddly modifiers for sure........and the last point is the most important to me.

 

[Undrave]

I am guessing the Players Handbook already has many "generic" backgrounds to choose from, plus basic how-to to customize a new background. A background includes several proficiencies (skills, tools, languages), plus a special non-combat asset. Ideal Flaw and Quirk also correspond the Background.

I am guessing this is good enough for anyone using the Forgotten Realms setting.

I guess it wasn't clear, but my suggestion was to replace racial modifiers and stuff, not backgrounds, which would be different. Your culture/civilization would be what you grew up in and your background is what you were DOING before adventuring.

Personally, I first start with what CLASSES are the most prominent for a specific locale in a specific culture.

Is it a culture or Wizards, Rangers, Rogues?

I was always under the impression that people with a proper class were a rarity. The PCs are exceptional individuals and that not every Magic User or 'Wizard' NPC is an actual WIZARD with class level. Not every criminal is a ROGUE and so forth.