Henadic Theologian
Legend
It does screw up the flavour, the choice should be at level 1.
You are still a warlock/sorcerer, you still have your magical patron/bloodline, your connection to them just isn’t strong enough yet for you to of determined what exactly they are yet but you know you’ve got a connection to something.If classes which currently start with their subclass at first level, such as warlocks, wizards and sorcerers, have their subclass choice moved to third, what would theses classes even look like their first couple of levels?
Wizards are pretty easy, as one who hasn’t specialized yet is still a recognizable student of the arcane arts.
But what about a warlock? If the idea is to remove the “blocker” of extra choices like cleric domains from initial character creation, the. What does that mean for selecting a patron? One could argue a warlock’s patron is a more mechanically important decision than a cleric’s deity, since their domain subclass choice can be selected independently of their deity, since one deity can have multiple domains. But choice of a patron dictates a warlock’s powers directly, closely followed by Pact selection.
So, what even is a warlock without a patron yet?
Same for a sorcerer. Their subclass is literally called “sorcerous origin”. What exactly is such a character that hasn’t selected their origin until third level?
Thoughts on how WotC might approach this issue if they stick to starting all subclasses starting at third level?
You choose your patron at 1st but your pact at 3rd in 5E. They don't need to change that, but maybe change what you get with your patron in some cases to coming at 3rd. As an example, with the Hexblade instead of Hexblade's Curse it could be moved to 3rd level.If classes which currently start with their subclass at first level, such as warlocks, wizards and sorcerers, have their subclass choice moved to third, what would theses classes even look like their first couple of levels?
Wizards are pretty easy, as one who hasn’t specialized yet is still a recognizable student of the arcane arts.
But what about a warlock? If the idea is to remove the “blocker” of extra choices like cleric domains from initial character creation, the. What does that mean for selecting a patron? One could argue a warlock’s patron is a more mechanically important decision than a cleric’s deity, since their domain subclass choice can be selected independently of their deity, since one deity can have multiple domains. But choice of a patron dictates a warlock’s powers directly, closely followed by Pact selection.
So, what even is a warlock without a patron yet?
Same for a sorcerer. Their subclass is literally called “sorcerous origin”. What exactly is such a character that hasn’t selected their origin until third level?
Thoughts on how WotC might approach this issue if they stick to starting all subclasses starting at third level?
Someone who might be in for a nasty surprise when they learn where those powerful "gifts" have been coming from.So, what even is a warlock without a patron yet?
Yeah, but what power? Do you still have to choose a patron or origin at first level? If so, then that defeats the purpose of pushing all subclasses to third level to simplify creating a new character.
Or even have the player not pretend - but the starter set they get from their patron is the same starter set all warlocks get.Considering the 0 levels are only there to last like two sessions, it's probably just going to be on the player to pretend until Session 3 where they can start playing their character, or on the DM to realize level 3 is the new level 1 and 1-2 are 0-levels for use with newbies you hate and preludes only.
Kind of weird that the devil gives the same powers as an angel, gives the same powers as a weird sword, gives the same powers as Lovecraft's sloppy seconds.Or even have the player not pretend - but the starter set they get from their patron is the same starter set all warlocks get.