D&D General What is an Adversarial Player?

[Imaculata]

Does something dickish.

Claims "It's what my character would do."

I've sadly had the misfortune of playing with those kinds of players. They got kicked out of the group quickly.

 

[Stormonu]

Ok, but most of the "adversarial" archetypes in this thread are Chaotic.

They come in all flavors of evil - Lawful Evil Rules Lawyers, Neutral Evil Lone Wolves and Chaotic Evil Campaign Breakers.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

Yeah, I had a friend back in the mid 90s run a game, do an awful job, get told he's never running for us again, and then I got elected to be the DM.

Usullay an Adversarial DM, who got kick out, and then return to player status.

I've known only two of these sorts, and they can be the worst. I had never encountered anything like them before, so I had no idea how to deal with that sort of behavior at the time. I don't game with either anymore.

The one, I don't think was really consciously trying to be disruptive, but the other, absolutely was. Their fun seemed to be solely in making the game more boring and difficult for the rest of the players, and more stressful for the DM. He considered it skilled play to "challenge" the DM by trying to slow the game to a crawl with digressions into minutiae or by trying to convince the rest of the group to never take the hook and go do something else.

I will add the player type I hate: The Ruin Player. This player does not even WANT to play the game, though they will often lie and say it is their "favorite" and will say all the standard 'buzz phrases'. But they have but one goal: to ruin the game for everyone.

Just about anything this player can do to ruin the game, they will do it eagerly. They love nothing more then to ruin everyones fun....as that is fun for them.

We may just be debating semantics here, but I think that there's a difference between someone that just knows the rules very well, and a Rules Lawyer. The former will speak up regardless of whether or not getting the rules right will hurt their character or not. The latter will only speak up when it's to their benefit, or will try to argue an...interpretation, shall we say, of the rules to benefit them.

I'm not sure I agree that Rules Lawyers mean to be adversarial, even if they can annoying. I've certainly encountered Rules Lawyers who are just overly obsessed with what they see as correctness.

 

[Greenfield]

Well, I have to admit that I'm a "Rules Lawyer" of sorts, but I try not to be disruptive. When a question comes up I'll explicitly ask, "Permission to rules lawyer?". And my DM(s) and other players know that I'm as likely to argue that the rules play against us as they do for us.

So I try not to be adversarial about it, but I like to know the rules of the game I'm in.

 

[overgeeked]

Another favorite adversarial player is the metagamer.

DM: Jim, your character takes 13 damage from the assassin’s backstab.

Player 01: I run across town to where Jim’s character is and...

DM: Why?

Player 01: Uh...Because I’ve suddenly remembered that I have a book of his I should return.

DM: And it has nothing to do with Jim being attacked? That your character knows literally nothing about.

Player 01: I’m offended you’d suggest that.

DM: How long have you had Jim’s book?

Player 01: Since 1st level.

DM: So now, miraculously, at 12th level, in the middle of Jim’s character being attacked, now you decide to return the book?

Player 01: Yep.

DM: Do you happen to have any items belonging to any other characters?

Player 01: Of course. Just in case.

 

[Maxperson]

This is a sort of counterpart to the Adversarial DM discussion.

What traits would you say define the "Adversarial Player"?

I've seen two flavors of this. Some player seem to play as if they were in competition with the other players, and strive to make the most powerful character. I had a player who wouldn't be satisfied unless his character had an AC at least five points higher than anyone else in the party, and hated the fact that his character could actually fail a Saving Throw.

The other sort is adversarial towards the DM. That is, they seek to "beat" the DM, often through rules-lawyering or flat out cheating. Some go so far as to try and derail the campaign, to prove that they're "better" than the DM on some personal scale.

You, of course, are free to supply definitions and/or examples of your own. That's kind of what this discussion is about, after all.

A cheater and/or someone who breaks the social contract.

 

[amethal]

Another favorite adversarial player is the metagamer.

DM: Jim, your character takes 13 damage from the assassin’s backstab.

Player 01: I run across town to where Jim’s character is and...

DM: Why?

Player 01: Uh...Because I’ve suddenly remembered that I have a book of his I should return.

DM: And it has nothing to do with Jim being attacked? That your character knows literally nothing about.

Player 01: I’m offended you’d suggest that.

DM: How long have you had Jim’s book?

Player 01: Since 1st level.

DM: So now, miraculously, at 12th level, in the middle of Jim’s character being attacked, now you decide to return the book?

Player 01: Yep.

DM: Do you happen to have any items belonging to any other characters?

Player 01: Of course. Just in case.

That needn't be adversarial.

Another way of looking at it is that one player's character was being threatened* and another player wanted his character to be able to do something to help them. (And friends turning up unexpectedly, in the nick of time, is a common trope in stories.)

*although 13 points of damage against a 12th level character, when attacking with complete surprise, isn't very threatening; in this case I think Jim's character might be just fine on his own ...

 

[Lyxen]

Another favorite adversarial player is the metagamer.

While I don't dispute the fact that some metagames can be adversarial, there are many types of metagaming, some more or less acceptable to any table, and not all of them adversarial.

 

[jasper]

An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.

An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.

An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
You comment has been stolen. Pray I don't steal again.
..
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.

 

[BookTenTiger]

An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.
You comment has been stolen. Pray I don't steal again.
..
An adversarial player tries to have fun by making the game not fun for others.

Did you get hacked, or are you showing an example of adversarial play?