D&D 5E what is it about 2nd ed that we miss?

[pemerton]

Classic/AD&D you just put spells in the slots and go - and the daily loadout only needs changing occasionally.
5e adds various bells and whistles to casters, enough that it'd be a pain.

Thanks for the reply - makes sense.

it's not just a sleep, but it's not a week either. It's a day of bed rest.

In AD&D 1st ed it is 1 week (unless Heal is used).

In that earlier version, there's also another wrinkle which I think may often have been ignored: the character dies if dropped below 0 hp (optionally -3); so the -10 buffer is there only for allowing the dying character to be saved. It is not a buffer as far as damage from attacks or spells are concerned.

 

[ZeshinX]

I do miss 2e, warts and all. While I certainly appreciate the d20 mechanic, I do find I miss all the disparate resolution mechanics possessed by 2e from time to time. Granted looking back it appears sloppy, unwieldy, warty and ugly...but it worked well enough and I did (and do) enjoy the variety that brought. Of course my groups played so frequently it became second nature to know which required high rolls, which required low rolls, or percentile, etc.

Of course, we did house rule the crap out of 2e. We ignored racial level limits. We switched dual-classing and multi-classing (we always felt that was backwards and that short-lived humans would be more likely to multi-class and the longer lived demihumans would dual class). We did eventually just get rid of dual-classing and allowed humans to multi-class in whatever combo they liked (max. 3 classes, conflicts we'd deal with if they came up and demihumans kept their usual limits on what classes they could multi-class). We got rid of certain racial weapon bonuses (elf getting +1 to long/short swords and bows, halfings with slings) and just gave those races a single free weapon prof, even if it might violate class restrictions (we found it never caused an issue). We gave Humans and Half-elves a +1 to an ability score of the player's choice at character creation. Everyone's 1st level HP was their CON score (later levels followed the usual rules). There were a ton more.

A big part of it too was there was so much product to choose from. It got crazy and unsustainable, sure, and some of that product was absolute crap (and some just broke things...looking at you Complete Book of Elves), but damn it was a good time.

 

[MechaPilot]

So what is it? Is it the multi-classing? Bounded accuracy? The absence of warlocks, barbarians etc? The saving throws? The less HP? The initiative system? Spell disruption? No cantrips? what?

For me, the only things that I miss from second edition are these:

1) The plethora of settings, with boxed sets that include specialty items like Ravenloft's Tarroka deck and the ship information and layout cards from Spelljammer.

2) The good times that I had with the friends I played it with.

3) 2e style multiclassing. Note that I say 2e style, because if I recall correctly, there were some small rules to it that I didn't care for. For example, again, if I'm recalling accurately, only non-humans could multiclass whereas humans had to be single class or dual class.


I enjoyed second edition a great deal when I played it, but I can't point to specific aspects of it as a game that don't or can't exist in other iterations of D&D.

 

[Ath-kethin]

I miss 2nd Edition multiclassing, which was I feel much more character-based and less focused on metagame power.

And I miss having classes balanced by their impact on a campaign and campaign world instead of directly against one another. In that vein, I miss having classes take different amounts of XP to level. I feel that such an approach is radically superior to WotC era approaches to game balance.

 

[MechaPilot]

I miss 2nd Edition multiclassing. . .

2e style multiclassing, where you levelled up in more than one class at the same time instead of choosing which one to level when you advanced (ala 3e and 5e), is my favorite style of multiclassing. I had completely forgotten about that in my post, so thank you for mentioning that.

 

[Zardnaar]

I have played with AD&D style MC as recently as a week ago and tomorrow I am playing 5E with a Monk. I have come to prefer it over WotC MCing. It is used in Castles and Crusades but you add the xp togather and add a bit more so you can be a level 5/5 Fighter/thief with a d8 hit dice. No more AD&D Fighter/thief6 with 1d110/2+1d6/2 (rounded down in both cases) and add half your con modifier.

I also do not mind the different xp rates for the classes either after using it again. Some classes like Thief could still do with a buff as I thought something like the 3.0 thief in a 2E campaign with the thief xp table would be fun. My players prefer 5E but I can usually talk them into a one shot or small campain for a module or 2 of C&C/AD&D/ or ACKs on occasion and I get to play 1E on rare occasions as a player.

I like the 2E balance (nerfed spellcasters compared with B/x and 1E) but some of the innovation in clones (tweaked classes, xp tables). Oh I miss the 2E speciality priest system although 5E domain system is the best since then IMHO.

 

[MechaPilot]

I have played with AD&D style MC as recently as a week ago and tomorrow I am playing 5E with a Monk. I have come to prefer it over WotC MCing. It is used in Castles and Crusades but you add the xp togather and add a bit more so you can be a level 5/5 Fighter/thief with a d8 hit dice. No more AD&D Fighter/thief6 with 1d110/2+1d6/2 (rounded down in both cases) and add half your con modifier.

Back in 2e, I used a houserule to simplify HPs from MCing where you just split the difference with regard to the die: if you had d10 and d6, you just used a d8. If you had two dice within one step of each other, for example a d10 and a d8, you just used the larger die type. If you had three different die types you could either use the middle one (if you had a d10, d8, and d6, you just used the d8) or you'd figure the die based on averages, rounding to the next highest die type (so a d10, d6, and d4 would work out to a d8).

 

[Shasarak]

In some instances, subtraction can be easier than addition, and in some addition can be easier. For example, which will take you longer, subtracting (3/4 - 2/4 = 1/4), OR (3/5 + 2/3 = ????). [19/15 = 1 4/15].

It's all a matter of perspective and what it is used for. It depends on what the problem or question is in regards to that addition or subtraction.

You do realise that your example of "addition" actually involves multiplication and addition, right?

A more fair example would be comparing subtraction (19/15 - 3/5=?) to addition (3/5 + 2/3 =?), which is easier.

 

[Shasarak]

The best things about 2e for me were definitely the settings, Spelljammer being my favourite but I also have very fond memories of most of the others.

I loved the Players Option books as well.

Dragon magazine was also rocking during the 2e era and I loved the novels that were coming out.

 

[Psikerlord#]

I miss 2nd Edition multiclassing, which was I feel much more character-based and less focused on metagame power.

And I miss having classes balanced by their impact on a campaign and campaign world instead of directly against one another. In that vein, I miss having classes take different amounts of XP to level. I feel that such an approach is radically superior to WotC era approaches to game balance.

Hmm yeah there was a certain balance in the wizard PC for example being 4th level while the rest of the party was 5th level, from time to time. Other times they would all tend to be the same level, or the thief one higher or on the cusp of one level higher.

Interesting thoughts.