What is the "Base Level" of your Campaign?

[ptolemy18]

The overall average level, counting both PCs and NPCs - 5th. Lots of people are really good at non-martial specialized tasks (cooks, scholars, artists, etc), otherwise how could a seemingly pseudo-medieval society function?.

I like the idea of non-PC classes (like Commoner, Expert and Aristocrat). They're good ideas. But frankly, they don't function at high levels.

The idea that it takes the same amount of "experience" to become a 17th level Wizard that it does to become a 17th level Commoner is absurd. Frankly, the very idea of a 17th level Commoner is pretty silly. ("I am the WORLD EXPERT on MILKING COWS! I can "Great Cleave" through three cows' udders at once!!!")

I also don't like the idea that some 17th level Commoner, with (theoretically) little or no combat experience, would have 30-50 hit points. That amount of hit points should reserved for people who actually go out and do stuff and fight monsters and generally kick ass. It's okay for heroes, but the idea of "normal" people taking multiple sword hits and shrugging it off is silly. (Of course, a 17th level Commoner is obviously abnormal, but you know what I mean.) A commoner who has some experience defending his farm would not be a 17th level Commoner, he'd be a 3rd level Commoner/1st level fighter (or something like that).

Therefore, in my campaign world, I prefer to think of Commoners and Warriors (and Experts and Aristocrats to a lesser extent) as being dead-end classes in terms of level advancement. I might "break the rules" to allow them to have higher skill caps than their low level would permit, but the idea that a "Commoner level" is equivalent to a level in a regular PHB class doesn't really work in practice. A high-level Aristocrat or Expert is more reasonable, but again in the case of the Expert, I'd rather "break the rules" to give them higher skills without the higher HP, saves and attack bonuses.

Jason

 

[Hjorimir]

The base level of somebody past apprenticeship is somewhere around 4th in my campaign. Your average city guard is 4th level, but he is more likely a warrior and not a fighter. The chump orcs of my world are 4th-level warriors. But, then again, I started the player characters at 5th level. It is all relative to how you want to play.

NPC classes are a great way to distinguish between merely being experienced and being both exceptional and having the benefit of specialized training. I actually don’t have a problem with a 17th-level commoner. That says to me a very experienced individual who has seen some amazing things and found a way to survive. He knows enough to step away when somebody swings a sword and has seen enough warriors do it that he has grasped some base level of understanding.

Overall, I’d say that I have a much higher percentage of NPCs in the 4th to 10th level range than standard D&D, but fewer of the higher levels. As was said before, there comes a time where you no longer get experience for CR1 encounters.

 

[Glyfair]

And it occurred to me... the easiest way to reduce the availability of magic in your games is simply to assume that everyone in the campaign world is fairly low-level. That way there simply aren't as many people who can create powerful magic items or cast powerful spells.

That's pretty much what Eberron does, combined with focusing most NPCs on NPC classes. Low level magic is very common. High level magic is very rare to almost non-existant.

Look at Raise Dead in the campaign world. Most priests aren't spellcasters, they're experts or commoners. Those that are spellcasters are usually adepts, which means they'd need to be 15th level to cast Raise Dead. You aren't very likely to find very many 15th level adepts. Of the remaining actual clerics, most are lower level and are usually out "in the field" where they aren't available.

What's left? Well, the head of the Church of the Silver Flame is listed as an 18th level cleric (while in the sanctum). How are you going to get to her? Through a large amount of bureaucracy. "This is an emergency? Please fill out this form to move to the emergency list. We'll let you know whether you are approved in a few weeks."

 

[argo]

Personally I find that low level characters (PC or NPC) being the standard gives me more headaches than any number of "magic shops". First level characters suck! And the idea that NPC's can't advance because they don't fight monsters is counter-intuitive as well.

So for me 1st level represents an incompotent youth (children <10 years don't even get stats) while 2nd level is "aprentice" and 3rd is the minimum for "competent adult". 4th level is probably the average for most professional NPC's. 5th is a "vetran" while 7-8th is a "master". Almost everybody will reach 7th level eventually if they live long enough but they may be too old to enjoy it much if they didn't lead "exciting" lives. 10th level is mostly reserved for "great" or "exceptional" people: warrior-kings, high priests and the like. Once you go above 12th level you start to enter the realm reserved for heroes and would-be legends.

So a demographic breakdown of my gameworld would look something like this (not that I'm build towns using this, rather it is a guide for me to guesstimate how compotent a NPC is likely to be)
1-3rd: 40%
4-6th: 35%
7-9th: 13%
10-12th: 6%
13-15th: 3%
16-19th: 2%
20+: 1%

One more thing. I abhore the Commoner class, it is not a good way to model the power difference between a PC and a NPC. It is a good way to waste a DM's time. Sure there are stableboys, dirt farmers and the like who are pathetically weak, however these people do not need or deserve stats because they are not going to accomplish anything in-game. If a NPC is important enough for me to bother giving him stats he is important enough to deserve PC classes or at least Expert.

Later.

 

[Hitokiri]

The vast majority of my world iare commoners. They do not have levels as far as I am concerned. Artisans, merchants, farmers, and the like are effectively 0th level in terms of HP and attacks. Their skills, on the other hand, do not follow the same limitations that PCs have. Level's, imho, are a measure forst and foremost of martial prowess and magical ability. PC are adventurers and warriors, they are the movers and shakers in the world, hence they gain skills differently than other people. I have no problems with an innkeeper being 0th level and having A craft skill like brewing of 15. He has worked hard his entire life to learn and master a trade which requires no need to ever become knowledgable about combat or magic. PC's on the other hand, are training themselves through experience, and their skills are essentially side jobs or supplimentary abilities that are superceded by their primary focus (fighing for fighters/barbarians, magic for wizards, Spirituality for clerics, etc). Thus the limits built into their progression. 95% of all the people in the world are 0th level commoners (and no, I don't make different classes for nobles, merchants, craftsmen, etc. That's stupid as far as I'm concerned. A "commoner" born into a noble family and who devotes his time learning diplomacy and etiquette is an aristocrat, whatever moniker his level is). Some people may learn some skills that give them a leveled class. Most soldier in an army are 1st level fighters (they've had some basic training, maybe even fought in a batlle or two). A hedge witch may have a level in wizard (can cast some low level spells). It is only the truly gifted that rise above this. This means that a troop of elite knights might be 2-3 level (and probably would be rather small in size, say, maybe 50 men in a large kingdom). 5th level characters would be likely the best person at what they do at a local level. 10th level characters would likely be the best in a large city (or even a kingdom). 15+ level characters are very rare, they would have something of a legendary status (many people would probably know of them and there are probably plenty of rumors about them). Anything 20 and up would be characters that are the stuff legends are made of, and it is likely their deeds, good or ill, would be remembered down through the centuries. In a world of a couple million people, a 20th level person or party may emerge every hundred years, or even less. If I had to break it down by the numbers, for a milion people:

"0th level commoners" (or effectively "no class") : 95%
1st level: 4%
2-4th level: ~1%
5-9th level: <200 (.02%)
10-14th level: <10 (.001%)
15-19th level: 1-2 (.0001%)
20th+ level: very VERY rare (likely 0%)

The results from this are that once the PC's make it to mid level, they ARE movers and shakers in the world, and high level PCs have become extremely important to the direction the world is headed.

 

[ptolemy18]

The vast majority of my world iare commoners. They do not have levels as far as I am concerned. Artisans, merchants, farmers, and the like are effectively 0th level in terms of HP and attacks. Their skills, on the other hand, do not follow the same limitations that PCs have. Level's, imho, are a measure forst and foremost of martial prowess and magical ability. PC are adventurers and warriors, they are the movers and shakers in the world, hence they gain skills differently than other people. I have no problems with an innkeeper being 0th level and having A craft skill like brewing of 15.

I totally agree, Hitokiri. Actually, I'd say that my campaign world has more level 1-4 PHB-class NPCs than yours does (representing soldiers and pencil-pushing "desk clerics" and Aristocrats and Experts and stuff), but I agree with your basic analysis that NPCs should be able to gain skill points without gaining all the other stuff that comes with "levels."

Jason

 

[Hitokiri]

Yeah. I just feel that trying to shoehorn every single person in the world into some sort of psuedo PC class results in as many problems as it solves. A blacksmith is just a blacksmith in my games. If, for some reason, it comes to combat, I'd probably give him a bonus to his attack much like a first level fighter (hey, he's been swinging his tools around for a long time and knows hgow to use them), but he shouldn't have more HP just because he's good at crafting plows. I also vary those numbers based on circumstance. A kingdom that has been fighting with the orcs frm the dark forest for the past 200 years is very likely going to have a higher number of 1-5 level classed people (they draft a lot of young men to help guard the borders, which gives them a lot of farmers who have some battle experience ). A kingdom that has known peace for a century will probably have fewer.

 

[LostSoul]

To make my campaign world low-magic, I didn't lower the base-level, I just reduced the number of casters. This would be the rare-magic formula. If you have lots of casters, no matter what level, your world won't be low-magic. Eberron is an example.

 

[Ace]

Average level -- Hmm Interesting Topic

I do it this way

I don't use Adepts --

As for Commoner, Freeman, Expert, Warrior and Aristocrat

L0 Kids -- I don't even stats these out

l1 -- apprentice types -- Young apprentices and Miitia men just out of basic training

L2-L6 everyone else

L7 Pretty experienced folks --

anyone better will have a reputation of sorts and will rarely be encountered

Warrior types (NPC class) over 10th level don't really exist though - anyone with a lot of combat talent will be a Fighter-- Elite types are always fighters. Conscripts, Grunts and folks with a bit of weapon training will have warrior levels

Example

Typical Senior Constable Inspector is L1 Warrior L6 Expert

Typical Constable is Warrior 3

Conscripted Farmer is War 1 Common 2

When I need an NPC I just use And Everyone Else and if you don't have it -- get it while its on sale -- its great !

Now PC classes can be any level except Epic level types tend to be rare There are about 2 Rogues and roughly 1 of each other class except for Arcane Casters.

The reason is that -- Divine casters usually want to go to Heaven and non casters usually don't live long enough.
Arcane casters OTOH do have access to life extension magic and usually the desire to live a long time

Intrestingly Undead are rarely Epic. Going that route hurts the ability to adapt and learn and thus slows level gain

 

[Remathilis]

I like Eberron for that, by the vast majority of NPCs are NPC classes. Only villians or occasional allies/neutral beings are higher than 7th-9th level. Aside from a few key NPCs (that adventure with them, only 2 players) and of course, the villians, there have been no NPCs that haven't been adepts (urban-Sharn), magewrights, warriors, aristocrats, or experts.