D&D 1E What makes a D&D game have a 1E feel?

tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
I play on a VTT with a grid and maps so, for me, the more beautiful the maps the better. I would have needed to recreate the Saltmarsh maps for them to meet my standards.
I use the arkenforge vtt & a tvbox similar to this for in person play & have actually moved towards simplifying maps somewhat at times because the players too often focus more on the details in J-Random premade good enough map I used than what I say since I'm not one of those GMs that railroads an adventure exactly as written right down to making everyone sit through reading out box text
 

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iserith

Magic Wordsmith
I use the arkenforge vtt & a tvbox similar to this for in person play & have actually moved towards simplifying maps somewhat at times because the players too often focus more on the details in J-Random premade good enough map I used than what I say since I'm not one of those GMs that railroads an adventure exactly as written right down to making everyone sit through reading out box text
Personally I don't mind if players focus in on the details of the map. I'll already have mentioned them in the description anyway. If I made the map myself though, I will tend to just have three things of interest though to keep things simple. But visually it looks as impressive as I can make it because I want to keep eyes on screens and not tabbed out on YouTube.
 

tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
Personally I don't mind if players focus in on the details of the map. I'll already have mentioned them in the description anyway. If I made the map myself though, I will tend to just have three things of interest though to keep things simple. But visually it looks as impressive as I can make it because I want to keep eyes on screens and not tabbed out on YouTube.
I think that last bit is the big difference, with in person play that's not so much of an issue, I'd rather they be watching me the gm or whatever other player is talking/gesticulating & looking over their sheets to plan for their turn or whatever. I find there's definitely a point where detail detracts from the gameplay
 

jayoungr

Legend
Supporter
Wow, this is an old thread!

I think for me, a "1E feel" (to the degree that I understand what that is, which I freely admit is imperfect) comes partly from an increased emphasis on the exploration pillar.
 

Marc_C

Solitary Role Playing
It was our first experiences playing D&D. Everything was new. The PCs didn't know the monsters, the magical items or the World of Greyhawk. It was our first campaigns. We can never go back to the original "1e feel". That was "magical".

It was very complicated and convoluted when you played it by the rules. I mean all the Gygaxian war-game rules. There was a lot of complaining by players about how the rules and classes worked even in the early 80s. We had debates and created many house rules. That was part of the 1e feel too. Not "magical".

1e PCs had nothing and became more powerful with the magical items they acquired during adventures. We described our PCs by listing the magical items they had. Not by feats, talents or skills. Progression was very slow.

5e is not at all like old school TSR D&D despite optional rules turn off buttons.
 


Celebrim

Legend
1) The key to 1e feel is the meeting of the mundane with the preternatural. That is, the game must be rooted in the ordinary and even the gritty, so that there is a recognizable quality of normality in the world. The starting point of the campaign must be somewhere the players can imagine in real history or at least some approximation there of. But at the same time, this must be a world where you move from that mundane reality to a world of high enchantment and mystery combined with not a small frisson of horror. You have the overworld with its gritty reality and an underworld (of some sort) where things are strange and dangerous. Very much, the setting supports a classic "Heroes Journey" Cambellian monomyth, in which the Haven is represents one world and the Dungeon the other. The ideal experience is for the player to feel like as they are playing the game, they've stepped through the wardrobe into Narnia or crossed that realm of sleep into the Far Country.

Modern D&D for all its merits just doesn't do it. "Honor Among Thieves" is not 1e feel, as the whole world is high magic and filled with wonder and right from the beginning the protagonists are partakers in that high magic world. Modern D&D from 3.5 on (played RAW or according to the apparent intentions of the designers) isn't fantasy at all but Swords & Capes Superhero genre. And while you can get there in 1e, you only get there in 1e by completing your Heroes Journey. Becoming a superhero in 1e D&D requires you passing through the Road of Trials.

2) First Edition feel is process simulation over game most of the time. If you look at Medusa, you turn to stone no matter how bad that works as a game mechanic, because in the genre and the stories you are trying to simulate that's how it worked. The first edition game masters and player base were "Playing at the World" as Jon Peterson so elegantly put it, and you can see this in a lot of the Dragon articles of the day or in the sort of stuff that Gygax felt the need to cover in the 1e DMG - everything from tax collection to siege mechanics to how rapidly the different races could mine different kinds of stone.

3) First edition feel is player skill tested ahead of character skill. Failure is the expected state and the goal is to try to transcend that expected result and "win". The players of 1e AD&D were coming directly out of a competitive wargaming background and initially the game was considered to be an imaginative extension of that. This is why "Tomb of Horrors" is such an iconic 1e feel module. Your choices matter far more than the playing piece you are playing. That isn't to say the character whose role you are playing doesn't matter, but ultimately it's secondary to the idea that careful and thoughtful and creative play should carry the day. The character in a sense is only there to protect you from your own bad decisions. The character doesn't make decisions for you, and does not innately have the ability to solve problems just to resist failures. This does get lost at times and you do see grindy luck based design in a lot of cases, but it never really gets completely lost the way that it does in later editions. But it's important to note that however much the players and GMs enjoyed the idea of superior play and skillful play, it was secondary to the simulated world. If the world was too false and artificial feeling, then success in that world didn't matter anyway. The goal was to feel like you were succeeding in the world of fantasy and story, and not to feel you were winning a board game.
 
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Voadam

Legend
Modern D&D for all its merits just doesn't do it. "Honor Among Thieves" is not 1e feel, as the whole world is high magic and filled with wonder and right from the beginning the protagonists are partakers in that high magic world. Modern D&D from 3.5 (played RAW or according to the apparent intentions of the designers) isn't fantasy at all but Swords & Capes Superhero genre. And while you can get there in 1e, you only get there in 1e by completing your Heroes Journey. Becoming a superhero in 1e D&D requires you passing through the Road of Trials.
I am not sure I agree. My understanding is that HAT is Forgotten Realms with I think not low level characters.

FR was high powered high fantasy from the pre-D&D stories and on. The 1e FR campaign boxed set has its sample adventure for low to intermediate levels dealing with a high powered absent minded lich.

1e AD&D at low levels is fairly mundane, but once you get going in 1e with levels and have a bunch of buffer hp and magic spells and/or magic items it is fantasy superheroes like 3e+ D&D.
 

Celebrim

Legend
I am not sure I agree. My understanding is that HAT is Forgotten Realms with I think not low level characters.

FR was high powered high fantasy from the pre-D&D stories and on. The 1e FR campaign boxed set has its sample adventure for low to intermediate levels dealing with a high powered absent minded lich.

1e AD&D at low levels is fairly mundane, but once you get going in 1e with levels and have a bunch of buffer hp and magic spells and/or magic items it is fantasy superheroes like 3e+ D&D.

Forgotten Realms was massively controversial and in some circles openly derided when it was first presented, and increasingly so as the NPCs that were published were more and more powerful, because in FR characters were roughly twice the level that would have been assigned to them in prior settings and typical play. This probably reached a culmination in publications like FOR6 The Seven Sisters (2e) which I remember being a straw that broke the camel's back for even FR supporters. In any event, FR is mostly "2e feel" and not "1e feel".

Personally, for a lot of reasons, and not just the power creep, I consider FR the worst fantasy setting ever published. It feels like a setting for non-gamers, popularized primarily by the novels of R.A. Salvatore and others, but not prized for its creativity or value as a game setting.

But the Hat of FR has become ubiquitous, and to a large extent most modern D&D in artwork and in settings as presented as a world pretty much indistinguishable from that of something like Thor: Ragnarok. Eberron is vastly better designed than FR, but it has that modern feel with magical hovercraft and trains and a general magic as technology feel.

As for the fact that 1e characters can eventually reach those heights, that isn't really a contradiction of anything I said. In fact, I mentioned that in my post. It's just that if the 1e characters do that, then they become exceptions in the world - Golden Age Heroes in a world that is otherwise largely mundane - needing to go off world to find most challenges - demi-planes, outer planes, the deep under dark and the most legendary dungeons. The ubiquitous high magic wasn't assumed to exist in the setting, but rather to be confined to the "dungeon" "under world".

 

Voadam

Legend
D&D's first published module was 1e's G1 Steading of the Hill Giant Chief where it recommended you have nine PCs of at least ninth level each and with two or three magic items.

The setup is that even though they are sent out as special forces to take on a literal fortress full of combatant giants, they can be threatened by the people of civilization.

"Therefore, a party of the bravest and most powerful adventurers has been assembled and given the charge to punish the miscreant giants. These adventurers must deliver a sharp check, deal a lesson to the clan of hill giants nearby, or else return and put their heads upon the block for the headsman's axe!"

As far as Gygax's 1e default surface world baseline I feel that Greyhawk is Gygax's D&D version of Lankhmar, complete with powerful wizards and an effective assassins guild, an influential thieves guild, god stuff that happens, etc. with plenty of room for high level magic and hijinks. Most of the populace is normal people, but I don't see it as the PCs are the only high level ones or the only superheroes in a background mundane surface world.

Most of the focus is on the dungeon adventuring, but the world of Greyhawk is set up with its 40 or so kingdom/empires and lots of power groups to have plenty of surface stuff going on if you want to focus there.
 

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