D&D (2024) What would you like to see in the new Monster Manual (2025)?

1- The Celestials are Zealous Fanatics seeking to impose their draconian version of Law regardless of opposition
2- the Celestials that the PCs are prophesied to cause great harm to the multiverse, they decide to act pre-emptively before destiny takes its course
3- factions of celestials are in conflict over a difference in doctrine, PCs are caught in the middle
4- Celestials have auras that debilitate mortals by their mere presence, the Celestials are in denial that they could be causing harm, so the PCs have taken it upon themselves to move them
5- a faction of Celestials has decided that mortals are corrupt and its time for Armeggedon to take place for the good of the universe
6- Celestials have misinterpreted information (or been deceived) and are seeking retribution against the wrong targets, the PCs have to defend the targets (which could be themselves or an entire city or an innocent child)
7 - Tieflings are declared evil hell-spawn and celestials are sent to wipe them out
Yeah, exactly. It doesn’t take much to make LG be the bad guy.
 

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What kind of conflicts can you see arising between none evil PCs and Archons, Guardinals, Angels, CG celestials, Empyreans, Sphinxes, etc...?
Circling back to this, think of it this way: just because two people a both good, that does not necessarily mean they are both on the same side.

Archons are good, but just as importantly they are also lawful. They want to impose order - a righteous and benevolent order, to be sure, but order nonetheless. So imagine a king, a good and righteous one, given a holy mandate to forge a continent-spanning empire and backed by a faction of archons to help him achieve that end, perhaps in preparation for some prophesized event centuries down the line in which said empire will be needed. The PCs live in a neighboring region that wishes to remain its own sovereign nation. The king is quite willing to negotiate very generous terms, but ultimately can/will not back down on annexing the region into his growing empire. Thus, war becomes inevitable.

On a grander, more planar level, the upper planes once made a committed push to end the Blood War eons ago, and it went horribly for them - the demons, devils, and yugoloths called a brief ceasefire, teamed up to absolutely decimate the celestial armies and force them to retreat back to the upper planes, then immediately went back to fighting each other like nothing had happened. While the guardinals and eladrin still make the occasional raid into the lower planes, usually as much smaller hunting parties, the archons have essentially spent the ages since preparing for the day when the Blood War comes to an end, when the lower planes are united at last and turn their fury against the rest of the multiverse. Celestia is now a planar fortress, with the armies of the Seven Heavens massing and training in preparation for a literally apocalyptic siege. Meanwhile, certain factions within the archons attempt to keep the Blood War going, selling celestial-made weaponry (through intermediaries) to both demons and devils in the hopes of keeping them killing one another for as long as possible.

On the other side of the proverbial spectrum, celestial eladrin (assuming they still exist) are good, but very much chaotic, so they work to tear down systems and hierarchies that they see as impeding people's freedoms, and that could very easily lead them to destabilizing governments and organizations that, while good, are too rigid and structured for their tastes, in the hopes of promoting freedom.

Angels are the servants of gods, so all you really need to do there is pit the will of the god they happen to serve against the interests of the PCs.

I'm not sure how much has been written about empyreans in 5e, but I believe they are more or less the equivalent of 3e/3.5e era titans, which (if memory serves) essentially makes them Greco-Roman style epic heroes and demigods. They show up on some epic quest to prove themselves, and whatever it is they seek puts them in conflict with the PCs.

For sphinxes, just go back to the classic - they will grant a boon if you answer their riddle, but fail and your life is forfeit.

Guardinals is a bit more difficult, but even they have things that are off limits - Belierin, the entire third layer of Elysium, is basically a giant planar prison for things the guardinals consider to dangerous to roam the multiverse.

So, yeah, there are ways to create conflict, even with nominally "good" foes, I'd say.
 
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Circling back to this, think of it this way: just because two people a both good, that does not necessarily mean they are both on the same side.

Archons are good, but just as importantly they are also lawful. They want to impose order - a righteous and benevolent order, to be sure, but order nonetheless. So imagine a king, a good and righteous one, given a holy mandate to forge a continent-spanning empire and backed by a faction of archons to help him achieve that end, perhaps in preparation for some prophesized event centuries down the line in which said empire will be needed. The PCs live in a neighboring region that wishes to remain its own sovereign nation. The king is quite willing to negotiate very generous terms, but ultimately can/will not back down on annexing the region into his growing empire. Thus, war becomes inevitable.

On a grander, more planar level, the upper planes made a committed push to end the Blood War eons ago, and it went horribly for them - with the demons, devils, and yugoloths basically making a brief ceasefire, teaming up to absolutely decimate the celestial armies and force them to retreat back to the upper planes, then immediately go back to fighting each other like nothing happened. While the guardinals and eladrin still make the occasional raid into the lower planes, usually as much smaller hunting parties, the archons have essentially spent the ages since preparing for the day when the Blood War comes to an end, when the lower planes are united at last and turn their fury against the rest of the multiverse. Celestia is now a planar fortress, with the armies of the Seven Heavens massing and training in preparation for an apocalyptic siege. Meanwhile, certain factions within the archons attempt to keep the Blood War going, selling celestial-made weaponry to both demons and devils in the hopes of keeping them killing one another for as long as possible.

On the other side of the proverbial spectrum, celestial eladrin (assuming they still exist) are good, but very much chaotic, so they work to tear down systems and hierarchies that they see as impeding people's freedoms, and that could very easily lead them to destabilizing governments and organizations that, while good, are too rigid and structured for their tastes, in the hopes of promoting freedom.

Angels are the servants of gods, so all you really need to do there is pit the will of the god they happen to serve against the interests of the PCs.

I'm not sure how much has been written about empyreans in 5e, but I believe they are more or less the equivalent of 3e/3.5e era titans, which (if memory serves) essentially makes them Greco-Roman style epic heroes and demigods. They show up on some epic quest to prove themselves, and whatever it is they seek puts them in conflicts with the PCs.

For sphinxes, just go back to the classic - they will grant a boon if you answer their riddle, but fail and your life is forfeit.

Guardinals is a bit more difficult, but even they have things that are off limits - Belierin, the entire third layer of Elysium, is basically a giant planar prison for things the guardinals consider to dangerous to roam the multiverse.

So, yeah, there are ways to create conflict, even with nominally "good" foes, I'd say.

Then that king is neither lawful nor good, he's a thief and murderer.
 



More Chaotic Celestials, most are Lawful Good, followed NG and LN, only a few are Chaotic. Like Pegasi, some Planar Incarnations, Empyreans, and Firemane Angels (which aren't for regular D&D settings, but should be added to the MM aling side Nymphs). We even got the Lawful Good and Neutral Good Celestial Paragon Races. We almost have more TN celestials in the Rilmani.
 

Balance out the damage resistances and immunities a bit - make poison a worthwhile attack option while reducing force damage’s superiority over everything (this last one probably should be handled within the spells and abilities that grant force damage.)
 


Mod and Save will not always be the same.
Is there a reason why they shouldn't be? Other than slight differences? How often is the mod going to come up vs the save? Realistically, how often is a monster doing a skill check, and even aside from that, how often should the monster's ability be demonstrably different than the save?

It seems like unnecessary complexity for little gain.
 

Is there a reason why they shouldn't be? Other than slight differences? How often is the mod going to come up vs the save? Realistically, how often is a monster doing a skill check, and even aside from that, how often should the monster's ability be demonstrably different than the save?

It seems like unnecessary complexity for little gain.
If ever there was a circumstance to collapse mod and save into one number, it’s for monster stat blocks. Just give monsters prof in two abilities (including all associated skills and the save) and be done with it. They’re monsters. Their skills almost never come up. There’s no reason to waste space for something that might, at most, come up 1-5% of the time.
 

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