Which is D&D? 4e or 2e?

[Remathilis]

EDIT: For the record, I do think 4e is D&D, but I can easily see the possibility of a package that says "ice cream" but contains no dairy products and is not cold. I can also understand why, for some, that day has already come.

Too true, too true...

 

[Shroomy]

To answer the OP, if you play 2e or 4e, you're playing D&D. Now, for some reason, I'm going to check the freezer for some ice cream.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

If you don't like 4E(or any edition for that matter), that doesn't make it not-D&D. It just means you don't like whatever it is you don't like. Saying that edition X is not-D&D is aggravating to those who believe otherwise.

 

[scourger]

2e, between those 2 options. But honestly, I know very little about 4e. I started on Basic, played a little 1e, a fair amount of 2e, a lot of 3e (after initially disliking it), and too much 3.5 to be good for my gaming. So, 4e was my chance to get off the ride before I really got sick. What I saw of it in the free preview material did not strike my fancy.

 

[cwhs01]

I've seen a number of threads similar to this, or seen this type of question pop up in other threads. But why is it even relevant to ask it?

If it is a fun game, what does it matter what label you give it? I accept that the label DnD could once be used to identify what game people were playing.
Now, with the numerous editions (becmi->4e), clone-games (castle and crusades etc.), 3x ogl stuff (mutants and masterminds, spycraft, conan etc.), using homebrew or official setting material, i don't think it makes sense saying any one thing is "True DnD", as opposed to "Not True DnD".

And so what?

The impression i get is that people liked the "feel" of some specific previous edition (ODnD, becmi, 1e, 2e, 2.5e, 3e, 3.5e), that they also feel is lacking or hard to find in the newest edition. The new edition is then said to lack the spirit or soul of "True DnD".
But with the extreme differences in playstyle between editions, this argument doesn't really seem to make sense to me. 3e is Not True DnD as it is not 2e is not 1e is not becmi... And none of those are 4e.

Ofcourse not. And so what?

 

[Umbran]

I'd follow some topics on 3e and say "hrm... thats strange and different". I was not a big fan (I was one of the nay sayers). Then 3.5 came out and I said "lol, looks like MMORPG on paper".

Except that in most ways, 3.5 and 3e really weren't at all different. If you weren't feeling it was like an online game at 3e, I fail to see how you think so with 3.5.

D&D today doesnt really look like anything I recognize from 20 years of play. If a 2e player says "I play D&D" and a 4e player says "I play D&D", they are not both playing the same game.

So what do we call 2e players, since the official company says 4e is D&D?

We call them all D&D players.

Do you have an idea of how many variants of poker are out there, and how different they are to play? But still, they're all poker.

Do you have any idea of how many house-ruled variants there have been, across all editions? But still, at each point, we called each other D&D players. All of a sudden, now we need to stop doing so? I don't accept that.

I think this incessant desire to draw a line between "Us" and "Them" between editions does us all a major disservice.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

We call them all D&D players.

Do you have an idea of how many variants of poker are out there, and how different they are to play? But still, they're all poker.

Do you have any idea of how many house-ruled variants there have been, across all editions? But still, at each point, we called each other D&D players. All of a sudden, now we need to stop doing so? I don't accept that.

I think this incessant desire to draw a line between "Us" and "Them" between editions does us all a major disservice.

I don't mean to make this worse than it already is, but I have to second this. If this sort of thing isn't an attempt to delegitimize playing D&D in a manner contrary to your opinion of how things should be, then what is it?

 

[justanobody]

I don't mean to make this worse than it already is, but I have to second this. If this sort of thing isn't an attempt to delegitimize playing D&D in a manner contrary to your opinion of how things should be, then what is it?

An attempt to stop sweeping generalizations in conversation?

Those people that call any RPG D&D don't help in communication.

People that are so obtuse to be so vague are just causing the deterioration of communication skills globally.

Why be so lazy to just say or type "D&D", when in fact you know it is 4th edition D&D?

I don't think typing on a forum anywhere will cause that many problems from adding the extra few bytes.

The half second to identify what you are talking about rather than generalize in the first place, removes the need for someone to ask you what you mean by it for you to have to take even more time to answer the question than if you had said "4th edition" in the first place.

Too many IM and texting people are corrupting the language due to laziness is what it is.

If you don't have time to formulate a complete thought, then don't waste another person's time trying to guess what you are trying to say.

Don't generalize, when you know you can be a little more informative and specific.

"I play AD&D 2nd edition" =/= "I played 4th edition D&D"

The problem is even bigger when you HAVE a proper name for something and generalize it. We might as well remove all peoples names and just define everyone by pronouns as he and she.

 

[Jack99]

Others might disagree, you for example might think 2nd to 3rd was a severe and too drastic a change. I argue the essence stayed the same. I don't think you can really make that argument for 4th edition.

You should try reading these boards. Plenty of eloquent and very intelligent people have done this countless times since June.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

An attempt to stop sweeping generalizations in conversation?

Those people that call any RPG D&D don't help in communication.

People that are so obtuse to be so vague are just causing the deterioration of communication skills globally.

Why be so lazy to just say or type "D&D", when in fact you know it is 4th edition D&D?

I don't think typing on a forum anywhere will cause that many problems from adding the extra few bytes.

The half second to identify what you are talking about rather than generalize in the first place, removes the need for someone to ask you what you mean by it for you to have to take even more time to answer the question than if you had said "4th edition" in the first place.

Too many IM and texting people are corrupting the language due to laziness is what it is.

If you don't have time to formulate a complete thought, then don't waste another person's time trying to guess what you are trying to say.

Don't generalize, when you know you can be a little more informative and specific.

"I play AD&D 2nd edition" =/= "I played 4th edition D&D"

The problem is even bigger when you HAVE a proper name for something and generalize it. We might as well remove all peoples names and just define everyone by pronouns as he and she.

Saying that "playing D&D" isn't a specific enough statement and saying that 4E "isn't D&D" are two completely different animals.