Which spellcaster should get which spellcasting system?

[BobTheNob]

My concern is for the state of the wizard. The Vancian system is the weakest of the bunch, leaving the wizard, who already has the worst hit points/armor/weapon options with the worst spell system as well. Basically, the wizard gives up a whole hell of a lot for his spell casting. The only thing that can make that work is if the wizards spells are simply so darn good they provide enough of an offset, which would require pretty potent stuff indeed.

So to me, you cant just look at the "spell system" in isolation, it has to be counter-balanced against the spells it supports.

 

[Ahnehnois]

The wizard pretty clearly has to be Vancian, but I don't think it's obligatory for anyone else.

The sorcerer needs to be spontaneous in some way or other.

Warlocks should have everything at will or as auras, to provide the no resource management option and because it's fun.

Clerics and druids should be able to do things spontaneously, particularly clerics, who should be able to pray for whatever they need at the moment.

Psionic types should use some kind of skill-based system with no spells, points, or slots.

a) no class gets infinite spell knowledge anymore, like 3ed clerics

b) whatever the mechanical choices, they come from the concept/fluff of the class, not just because it has to be something different or "new"

Good points. I'd add that I hope spell slots and spell levels are taken out of the equation as much as possible, to be replaced with points, prerequisites, and other mechanics.

 

[drothgery]

As long as Wizards are vancian, I'm fine with whatever they come up for the others. I do not mind if other classes are also vancian, neither I mind if the Wizard is the only one.

But then, I really hope that:

a) no class gets infinite spell knowledge anymore, like 3ed clerics

That wasn't the problem, I think. The problem was access to all spells combined with a diverse, powerful, and ever-expanding spell list. I kind of liked the short spell list + know everything on your list + spontaneous casting of the specialist-in-a-box classes in 3.5 expandsion material (warmage, beguiller, artificer, dread necromancer).

 

[Li Shenron]

That wasn't the problem, I think. The problem was access to all spells combined with a diverse, powerful, and ever-expanding spell list.

Well if the cleric spell list in 5e was a lot shorter, then there wouldn't be a problem, but I don't know how likely it is, since 5e also aims at incorporating as much traditional material as possible, and that presumably includes spells. Plus, it's practically impossible that the list won't be ever-expanding, not for such a core popular class as the cleric.

So in order to prevent that, I think it would be best if the cleric either had a fixed number of spells known to choose from the list (like the 3ed Sorcerer) or fixed number + add more spells at a cost (like the 3ed Wizard).

 

[Minigiant]

If I were to expand on how I prefer the warlock, I'd prefer if each of the warlock's magic to have it's one usage and duration separate for each other base of the magic's own power. They's be like spell slot but be permanent filled and be regained (if spent at all) on times independent of each other.


You'd have at-will powers like Eldritch blast and blast shapes. Then there are encounter invocations that are similar to weak spell that recharge after a short rest. Then there are daily invocation that alter the warlock for 24 hours.

For example Muva the fey pact warlock has 4 invocations.

Eldritch Blast Effect: Cha or Con +2 Blast attack for 1d10 damage. Duration: At-will
Misty Curse Effect: Cursed enemy has disadvantage on attack greater than 15 ft away. When cursed enemy is reduced to 0 or fewer HP, the warlock can instantly teleport up to 15 ft. Duration: At-will
Witchfire Effect: Target takes 2d6 fire damage, Dexterity save for half. Duration: Once per short or long rest
Spiderwalk: Effect: The warlock or touched ally is under the effect of spiderclimb for 24 hrs. Duration: Once per day.

Although Muva took 2 at-wills, an encounter, and a daily; she could have taken any combination provided she still takes Eldritch Blast: EB + 3 at-wills, EB + 3 encounters, EB + 3 daily buffs, EB + 2 encounters + a daily buff, etc...

 

[Kavon]

What if I want to play a learned book-ish spellcaster that doesn't use the Vancian system?

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

Wizard = prepared Vancian
Cleric = spontaneous Vancian (3e sorcerer-style)
Warlock = at-will, very limited encounter/daily abilities
Psion = PP

I hope all these options are in the PHB, so that new players can blast bad guys without memorizing a 50-page spell list.

 

[Minigiant]

What if I want to play a learned book-ish spellcaster that doesn't use the Vancian system?

Convince your DM to let you play an Int based sorcerer

 

[Ahnehnois]

What if I want to play a learned book-ish spellcaster that doesn't use the Vancian system?

Pick up Unearthed Arcana 5e?

Hopefully, they put some alternate magic systems of that ilk in the core books.

 

[Kavon]

Convince your DM to let you play an Int based sorcerer

Wouldn't it be better if I didn't have to?
Also, who's to say that the sorcerer won't come into its own in such a manner that it's not so simple?

Hopefully, they put some alternate magic systems of that ilk in the core books.

Yes, this is what I'm hoping for, at least.