Why all the hate for Turn Undead?

[Rhenny]

Turn Undead is a wonderful role-playing opportunity demoted to a magical attack. I like magical attacks but we already have those. Any little clichéed scene that can function as an easy role-playing excercise must be preserved. Who wouldn't rather make a Anthony Hopkins impression than roll on a chart (for this too).

I like how the current spell version promotes roleplaying. (The ability to hold the spell for multiple rounds is a winner). The cleric in our last playtest was able to thrust his holy symbol toward 4 skeletons, utter a prayer to his god, and 2 of the 4 skeletons turned back from the party. The 2 unaffected ones, came forward to attempt to skewer the Cleric. Two of the party intercepted one of the skeletons and dropped it to the ground, but the remaining skeleton struck the Cleric. The cleric stood resolutely took the hit, and then maintained the spell for another round. (The player was really into this. He even stood up and held his imaginary holy symbol out before him...saying, "back...back...unnatural creatures of death and decay." He battled the pain of his wounds to keep the others in the party safe, and eventually they prevailed.

 

[Minigiant]

I have no problem with Turn Undead as a spell or a feature.

I just preferred that the spells the cleric cast and what his or her Channel divinity was based on the cleric's domain and deity.

 

[tuxgeo]

I have no problem with Turn Undead as a spell or a feature.

I just preferred that the spells the cleric cast and what his or her Channel divinity was based on the cleric's domain and deity.

Regarding spells, they added that feature in this latest iteration of the playtest: Sun domain and War domain clerics each get one domain spell at first level that is always "prepared."

They could do something similar with channel divinity, as 4E did: create feats for each deity, or for each domain, that give an appropriate way to use CD; but they could change that so, at the same time, each such feat also gives an extra use of CD per day.

 

[Zaukrie]

Why should I have to use a feat? Clerics should get CD powers unique to their deity or belief system/domain.

 

[Minigiant]

Regarding spells, they added that feature in this latest iteration of the playtest: Sun domain and War domain clerics each get one domain spell at first level that is always "prepared."

They could do something similar with channel divinity, as 4E did: create feats for each deity, or for each domain, that give an appropriate way to use CD; but they could change that so, at the same time, each such feat also gives an extra use of CD per day.

Yeah, I noticed that change. I'd just prefer that Channel Divinity does not default to either healing nor Turn Undead. It should be domain based. Sun gets Wearing Light, Good gets Turn Undead, War gets Crusader Strike, Healing gets CLW, Plant gets Entangle, etc.

 

[Greg K]

Yeah, I noticed that change. I'd just prefer that Channel Divinity does not default to either healing nor Turn Undead. It should be domain based. Sun gets Wearing Light, Good gets Turn Undead, War gets Crusader Strike, Healing gets CLW, Plant gets Entangle, etc.

Except for Good getting turn undead, I agree. I would rather see Turn Undead for deities of life or the repose (domain for gods of death that ensure the dead remain resting or in the land of the dead).

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

I like the current version...having played the cleric as a demented undead hunter...

However I agree it should be a domain option. I would prefer it as an orisen that can be cast using a spell slot for scaled effect. I would also prefer domain variants for turn elemental, turn demon, turn humanoid, turn animal.... and the obverse of command X.


Then put in that non clerics can attempt this action with a -10 to the dc based on a skill like undead lore.



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[Li Shenron]

I don't even understand what it the real purpose of Channel Divinity at the moment.

In the previous iteration it seemed that it was meant as a generalization of Turn Undead, in fact it allowed (a) turn undead and (b) healing allies, and it was a few times per day, which is a good extension to your other magic powers (spells at 1st level were less per day than channeling).

But now it only allows (b) and it's only 1/day IIRC... What does it add to the game? Nearly nothing, it's almost redundant. Because of this, I am quite sure that channel divinity is far from its final form... it will certainly be revised and expanded later on.

Making it domain-dependent sounds like a good idea to me, it helps once more differentiating clerics of different deities. However it could be deity-based instead (if deities are supposed to have more than 1 domain for the cleric to choose from), so that all clerics of a deity have always at least something in common.

 

[Shadeydm]

I've never had a problem with all clerics being able to turn undead. To me its a function of faith and what cleric wouldn't have that?

 

[Steely_Dan]

Certain Clerics don't give a crap about undead, or, embrace them.