D&D 5E Why do Sorcerers have so few spells compared to other full Casters

[ScuroNotte]

Half Caster spells are equal in number to the Sorcerer, while all the other full casters far exceed the Sorcerer.
I initially thought that the Warlock shared the same limitations, but then realized I was mistaken.

The Warlock has 15 known spells. Through Mystic Arcanum, they gain 1 additional spell of 6th, 7th, 8th, and 9th level for an additional 4 spells. Then through Invocations, they could gain at will usage of 11 spells and once per long rest of 7 spells.
In total they have potentially 37 spells available to them based on the Invocations selected. Yes they have 4 spell slots for spells at 5th level, but they regain them after a short rest.

So why the strict limitation on the Sorcerer?

 

[crashtestdummy]

We have a bard and a sorcerer in our party and I noticed the same thing at lower levels. The offset is that the sorcerer has more cantrips than the bard, with the total of spells known and cantrips being equal at lower levels. This changes with magical secrets, but I saw it as being part of the game balance. By restricting the number of spells available to use meta-magic on, the sorcerer's power level is controlled.

Quickened and twinned spells can be very powerful, so controlling the number of spells the sorcerer has available is the balancing factor.

 

[Hawk Diesel]

I've tried to figure this out and couldn't. I think the Storm Sorcerer went in the right direction in UA with the expanded spell list (giving the sorcerer 9 extra spells below 5th level that are themed with respect to their archetype). I don't know why they changed it in SCAG except that they'd need to retcon the other archetypes. I house rule that sorcerers get a a themed spell list. I'll post them sometime tomorrow.

I also house rule that sorcerers can create spell slots up to 6th level. This way, their sorcery points allow more equivalence to the wizard's arcane recovery ability.

 

[Hawk Diesel]

We have a bard and a sorcerer in our party and I noticed the same thing at lower levels. The offset is that the sorcerer has more cantrips than the bard, with the total of spells known and cantrips being equal at lower levels. This changes with magical secrets, but I saw it as being part of the game balance. By restricting the number of spells available to use meta-magic on, the sorcerer's power level is controlled.

Quickened and twinned spells can be very powerful, so controlling the number of spells the sorcerer has available is the balancing factor.

They are powerful, but they also quickly drain those sorcery points. So they end up nova-in out if they do that. Yet wizards can cast way may often, and even eventually get to cast select 1st and 2nd level spells like cantrips.

Sorcerers were initially the spellcasters that could cast spontaneously and more often, while wizard's needed to prepare and cast less often, but had greater flexibility. Now, sorcerers get shafted in flexibility through severely limited spell choice, but cast an equal number of spell slots. Seems a bit uneven to me, even if metamagic flexibility is taken into consideration (especially given that sorcerers get access to relatively few metamagic options).

 

[crashtestdummy]

Er...I should check. Are we talking about spell lists or spells known/prepared?

Sorcerers have the most cantrips known of any of the classes (one higher than Wizards and Clerics and two higher than Bards and Druids). Up until around level 10, the total of spells known/prepared plus cantrips known is roughly equal across all the pure spellcasting classes. Wizards, Clerics and Druids (the ones with flexible preparation) pull ahead because the number of spells prepared includes their spellcasting stat bonus, which at level 8 will generally be +5.

As far as spell lists are concerned, that appears to be a major part of the game balancing -- restricting which spells each class has available to them. Sorcerers still have a wide variety of spells available, even if it's not as comprehensive as the Wizards.

 

[ScuroNotte]

The forte of the sorcerer in D&D has always been, "Less variety, more bang"... Their sorcery points and metamagic let them do a lot of stuff with what they have, but they balance that out by having a narrower focus than the other casters.

Sorcery points can only be spread so far. Also not every Sorcerer is a blaster. I chose Sorcerer as it fit best for my character concept. Why penalize because a player for trying to play a character differently. Other spellcasters, both full and 1/2 casters, have other abilities that make it powerful and have larger selections of spell's known.
Wizards can be blisters and regain spell slots after short rest. That's powerful. Twinning spell's can be very costly. And with a limited pool between long rests, can be depleted very quickly.

BTW my character doesn't have twinning (though have quicken) and no plans on getting it. I have Subtle. Not everyone tries to build the most powerful character.

 

[ScuroNotte]

Er...I should check. Are we talking about spell lists or spells known/prepared?

Sorcerers have the most cantrips known of any of the classes (one higher than Wizards and Clerics and two higher than Bards and Druids). Up until around level 10, the total of spells known/prepared plus cantrips known is roughly equal across all the pure spellcasting classes. Wizards, Clerics and Druids (the ones with flexible preparation) pull ahead because the number of spells prepared includes their spellcasting stat bonus, which at level 8 will generally be +5.

As far as spell lists are concerned, that appears to be a major part of the game balancing -- restricting which spells each class has available to them. Sorcerers still have a wide variety of spells available, even if it's not as comprehensive as the Wizards.

Spells known is the topic
Clerics & Land Druids get 20 spells, plus modifier bonus, plus bonus spells making over 30 spells known.
Moon Druids know 25 (more if wisdom over 20)
Wizards know 20, plus Intelligence modifier. At higher levels, can cast low level spells with no loss of spell slots
Paladins know 15, plus wisdom modifier, plus bonus spells which can make 23 to over 28
Warlocks know 15, plus 1 each of levels 6-9, and with invocations, know potentially 37 spells

Sorcerer at 15. Yes we have Metamagic which can be quickly depleted and not always useful depending on situation.

I would say increase number to 20 known spells. That is not overpowering. And still less than Lore Bard at 24

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

The Warlock has 15 known spells. Through Mystic Arcanum, they gain 1 additional spell of 6th, 7th, 8th, and 9th level for an additional 4 spells. Then through Invocations, they could gain at will usage of 11 spells and once per long rest of 7 spells.
In total they have potentially 37 spells available to them based on the Invocations selected.

15 known spells + 4 Mystic Arcana + 8 invocations is 27. How are you getting 37? Just a typo?

 

[ScuroNotte]

15 known spells + 4 Mystic Arcana + 8 invocations is 27. How are you getting 37? Just a typo?

Yes. Sorry. Meant to say 27. I originally counted all the potential Invocations that involved spells known and accidentally included all instead of the 8 max known. Thank you for correcting me

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

Sorcerers have the potential to have more spell slots than most other casters, so they don't also get to have just as many (or worse, more) options for what to have those spell slots do.