Why do you think the Bard gets no play?

[arnon]

I'd use the Monte Cook Bard from CBoEM (in fact i'm using it now)... but truly, i like the 3.5 bard just fine as well.

Problem i see with all those people thinking that Bards are useless (like already some have mentioned here) as well as why some people believe CHA to be a dump stat, is that they play in one of those games where all you do is fight and maybe (just maybe) talk with someone, but that to, only to get a new "quests".

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

IME, bards don't get played because many people don't think of themselves as creative, so there's already a mental block around playing a class that is designed to be intrinsically creative.

On a certain level, its more alien to them to sing magic than to merely cast it.

 

[Priest_Sidran]

Bards are great the way they are, that said, their are a number of variant bards out their already.

My suggestion is give them some more choices as per the rogue special abilities (of course bard related) make their actual spellcasting non singining or perform element related, though have them able to use their instrument to dazzle people (I.e Charm) without the listener being willing.

A good resource for how a d20 bard should play out is the series Bardic Voices by Mercedes Lackey.

The Free Bard like gypsies have no settled home, they travel from tavern to tavern, or hire on in the house of minor or major nobles (depending on ability) during the winter. As apposed to Guild Bards who do not have magic, Free Bards are able to use certain songs as a catalyst for a spell, while other songs are just songs. They are able to cast spells in combination with other bards who sing/play in a Choral/troop style of music.

Some thoughts PS

 

[Imruphel]

IMC, I give them a d8 for hit points and bonus feats starting at 2nd level and every there levels thereafter. I also give them the feat from Complete Adventurer at 1st level that allows them to apply the Perform skill to (1+Int bonus) different types of performances (IIRC). Anyway, it's been largely irrelevant as nobody will play one (although one would be perfect for this campaign).

I have two bard NPCs at the moment that the party are likely to encounter in a hostile way:

- a half-illithid derro bard that plays the bonethriven (illithid instrument from 2E's The Illithiad); and
- a dancer, a very deadly dancer, who is a bard and a spy and possibly a battle dancer as detailed in Dragon Compendium V1.

 

[jasin]

The bards don't get much play because the majority of a typical D&D campaign is combat, and as useful as a bard can be in combat, he's rarely the star of it. Even if it's because of that +2 that the barbarian gets to hit and take down the dragon, most people want to be the one to actually take down the dragon, not the one to provide the +2.

As an additional twist, shy or reserved players who might be interested in such a support role might be put off by the whole performer theme and the need to suddenly take center stage in social situations, and go play an artificer.

That said, I don't think the bard really needs to be fixed. I could imagine tweaks that would make them more to my liking (for example, giving the spells a scavanger/jack-of-all-trades feel by giving them an option to pick up spells from other classes), but I think they're more or less fine as they are as long as you know what you're doing. And you get to use the "oh, come on, it's a bard!" argument when the DM is in doubt whether to allow something you want.

 

[Drowbane]

Bards make decent Cohorts.

Hey all,

As with a few other threads I had going on in this forum (e.g. Barbarian and Sorcerer changes), I am trying to pool ideas for some changes to the Bard class. What changes would you make to the Bard to make him/her a more effective class? What would you do to get the Bard out of the pigeon-hole of being the "5th character"?

I really enjoyed the Dark Sun version of the Bard, but I would like to keep spell-casting.

Any ideas or suggestions?

There is a powerful perception of "the Bard sucks". Hell, this perception might even be correct.

Alot of players won't bother with a class that "everyone" thinks is crap... there are alot of classes out there to play first.

I (for example) haven't yet gotten to play a: beguiler, dragon adept, dragon shaman, erudite, knight, lurk, swordsage, totemist... and even if I was stuck with "core only"... there are 10 other classes in the PHB I'd rather play again two-three times each before I roll up a Bard.

 

[jasin]

IMC, I give them a d8 for hit points and bonus feats starting at 2nd level and every there levels thereafter. I also give them the feat from Complete Adventurer at 1st level that allows them to apply the Perform skill to (1+Int bonus) different types of performances (IIRC). Anyway, it's been largely irrelevant as nobody will play one (although one would be perfect for this campaign).

I would so play this.

Whirlwind Attack + Arcane Strike + UMD divine power wand = sweet.

 

[Baby Samurai]

I have always loved, and played bards. Considering the class is partially (quite a bit) based on Orpheus (sp?), I think they are bad-ass, and with a good DM they can be real encounter saviours.

 

[Drowbane]

PrC

Also, the Bard is a very strange class. Among the Core Classes, it is up there with Paladin and Ranger for "why isn't this a PrC" again? My guess is that WotC left them base to as not slaughter some Bovine.

"So, you want to play a singing Rogue Expert who knows a few Wizard and Cleric spells and who happens to just know a bunch of random facts cause he hangs out in taverns?"

 

[sirwmholder]

Also, the Bard is a very strange class. Among the Core Classes, it is up there with Paladin and Ranger for "why isn't this a PrC" again? My guess is that WotC left them base to as not slaughter some Bovine.

"So, you want to play a singing Rogue Expert who knows a few Wizard and Cleric spells and who happens to just know a bunch of random facts cause he hangs out in taverns?"

QFT

William Holder