D&D 5E Why FR Is "Hated"

[Shasarak]

The answer is not that they are PCs. The answer is that Elminster is busy countering Fzoul. The Simbul has her hands full with Thay. And so on. These NPCs are busy with their own plots and the PCs are the only ones that can handle this plot. If they fail, the world ends for them AND those NPCs. Nobody is going to come in at the last moment to save them and the world if they are about to fail.

I agree. Between the amount of Villains doing stuff and the amount of Villains waiting for someone else to do something so that they can get a surprise attack, it seems like the Realms getting destroyed is just a normal Tuesday.

 

[MackMcMacky]

No, you have that backwards. The lore of the Realms is fairly consistent, because it has in-game events which explain any discrepancies. It might seem like a HandWave, but in a world with literal gods and god-level wizards, you don't really need to justify it beyond saying that AWizardDidIt.

To contrast, something like Greyhawk is wildly inconsistent, because it doesn't even acknowledge how the reality of the game world changes based on the ruleset you're using. It's asking you to pretend that those inconsistencies aren't there, when they clearly exist for everyone to see. A flimsy explanation is better than no explanation whatsoever. A DeusExMachina is preferable to an outright Retcon.

You might want to study up on the Fate of Istus, an adventure in Greyhawk that had everything to do with switching from 1E to 2E. I disliked the premise but you might enjoy it as is. I used portions without using the whole 1E/2E switch event.

 

[MackMcMacky]

@Morrus;Earlier someone mentioned the FRealms are the Borg of D&D and look at the latest announcement - Acererak of Tomb of Horrors and Greyhawk fame is now being inserted into Chult in the FRealms.

If the FRealms are so awesome why are the old adventures that are inspiring the new adventures so often NOT from the FRealms?

 

[Dorian_Grey]

Neutral-good Necromancers. Heh. I'll be interested in hearing how you pull that off.

Osiris of course! The idea of being reborn is key to the Egyptian mythology - and since that is the basis for the setting, I feel free to keep it. Those who are properly dedicated are given life after death, much like Osiris was given life after death. He is especially merciful. Necromantic magic is seen as coming from Osiris, and there is considered a role for most everyone - no matter their income. So priest-kings become mummies due to their wealth and ability to afford the greatest dedications. However, even a poor temple guard can guarantee some service in the form of a skeleton, zombie, or other such creature. Zombie soldiers, known as the Grey, are greatly honored for their service and dedication to the temples. Soldiers who die in battle are often given the honor of being grey without having to pay for any of the funeral services.

Essentially, giving your body in service to the Celestial Temple guarantees you an elevated place in the afterlife. Mummies, of course, keep their intellect, as do other intelligent undead - but over the centuries might choose to slip the mortal coil and join Osiris as his trusted advisors.

 

[Lanefan]

The one nice thing that I have to say about Forgotten Realms is that it is the only setting that has stayed consistent over the editions, because it incorporates edition changes into the setting itself. The reality of the Forgotten Realms consistently reflects the rules of the edition at that point in history.

I once played a level 1 character in a 4E campaign that had been level 20 for decades of in-game time, but who had suffered from level drain at some point between the Time of Troubles and the Spellplague. Permanent level drain wasn't part of 4E, but it was part of how the world worked at the time it happened. If a 5E character gets sent backward in time, they will wind up in a world that is literally operating under different natural laws. It opens up a lot of possibilities that don't make sense in other settings, where they pretend that reality has been fundamentally similar all throughout history.

This is a really cool way of looking at it, and also opens up all kinds of adventuring/plot/story options. Like it!

The City State of the Invincible Overlord (1976) and City State of the World Emperor (1980) are two different city states in Judges' Guild original 'AD&D compatible' Wilderlands of High Fantasy campaign setting.

Technically, neither of them is a true "city state" since both are the capital of an empire. Judges Guild did cover the area around the CSotIO but it was in separately published products, the CSotWE had everything in one package.

I stand corrected, then. (but see below) I've got (most of) WE and a friend/fellow DM has IO, I always thought they overlapped.

Don't conflate those fish-walloping green degenerates of the Viridistan World Emperor with the glorious citizens of the Overlord!

Yet here you confuse me. Vridistan is from IO - it must be, as my friend what only has IO (and has never had WE that I know of) has had the Vridi empire in his game since forever. EDIT: never mind - turns out he had WE all along and I just didn't know it.

Judges Guild also published a third one - the City State of Tarantis (1983).

Now this has got my complete attention, as before now I'd never heard of such a thing!

Lan-"and I probably don't even want to think about the kind of $ it'll take to get a copy of Tarantis"-efan

 

[Hussar]

@Morrus;Earlier someone mentioned the FRealms are the Borg of D&D and look at the latest announcement - Acererak of Tomb of Horrors and Greyhawk fame is now being inserted into Chult in the FRealms.

If the FRealms are so awesome why are the old adventures that are inspiring the new adventures so often NOT from the FRealms?

Let's be fair here. FR has never been associated with great adventures. Yes, there have been some over the years (even a blind squirrel finds his nuts once in a while), but, none of the really memorable modules have come out of Forgotten Realms. When Dungeon put out it's 30 Greatest D&D Adventures of All Time the only FR module to make the list was Undermountain and that was halfway down the list.

I mean, quick, name 3 memorable Forgotten Realms adventures...... *crickets chirping*

FR's known for a lot of fantastic things, but, adventures isn't one of them.

 

[MackMcMacky]

This is a really cool way of looking at it, and also opens up all kinds of adventuring/plot/story options. Like it!

I stand corrected, then. (but see below) I've got (most of) WE and a friend/fellow DM has IO, I always thought they overlapped.

Yet here you confuse me. Vridistan is from IO - it must be, as my friend what only has IO (and has never had WE that I know of) has had the Vridi empire in his game since forever.

Now this has got my complete attention, as before now I'd never heard of such a thing!

Lan-"and I probably don't even want to think about the kind of $ it'll take to get a copy of Tarantis"-efan

You can get a download of it for $8.99 at Drive Thru.

 

[Lanefan]

You can get a download of it for $8.99 at Drive Thru.

Thanks for the tip but pdf's just don't do it for me, particularly as one of the maps is something like 22x38 inches and my printer just doesn't go that big. But at least now I know it exists, which I didn't an hour ago.

Lan-"paper or nothing"-efan

 

[MackMcMacky]

Let's be fair here. FR has never been associated with great adventures. Yes, there have been some over the years (even a blind squirrel finds his nuts once in a while), but, none of the really memorable modules have come out of Forgotten Realms. When Dungeon put out it's 30 Greatest D&D Adventures of All Time the only FR module to make the list was Undermountain and that was halfway down the list.

I mean, quick, name 3 memorable Forgotten Realms adventures...... *crickets chirping*

FR's known for a lot of fantastic things, but, adventures isn't one of them.

I would think a fantastic published campaign setting would be able to provide fantastic published adventures and yet it hasn't. I suspect it may have something to do with the approach of placing so much importance on the agency of NPCs and "Factions".

 

[billd91]

Let's be fair here. FR has never been associated with great adventures. Yes, there have been some over the years (even a blind squirrel finds his nuts once in a while), but, none of the really memorable modules have come out of Forgotten Realms. When Dungeon put out it's 30 Greatest D&D Adventures of All Time the only FR module to make the list was Undermountain and that was halfway down the list.

I mean, quick, name 3 memorable Forgotten Realms adventures...... *crickets chirping*

FR's known for a lot of fantastic things, but, adventures isn't one of them.

Maybe, but it's probably also influenced by the division of fans/customers into so many different product lines as well. One of the things that made those 30 greatest AD&D adventures so great is the broad, shared experiences in the community.