Why I think you should try 4e (renamed)

[Jasperak]

EDIT-While I consider this thread an insult against my simulationist tendencies, I don't want to be a dbag about it.

 

[BryonD]

I didn't find that very convincing.

Judging only from what you've written there it seems like I've got two choices.

1) Play 3e and have a realistic system that works, plus I can use my imagination with it to make it even better.

2) Play 4e and the system is so dull, boring and nonsensical that I'll have to cover over its system flaws with my imagination.

I'm not saying that's what 4e is actually like, I'm just saying that's how it sounds in your post.

This was my thought as well.
I don't want to get baiting in to someone else's over-statement of 4E's flaws.

But if all the "fun" comes from outside the book, then can you remind me what exactly it is that I'm buying?

Roleplaying isn't between the covers of a book. But the game mechanics must live up to my roleplaying.

 

[WarlockLord]

I don't mean to be a troll, but I think HP inflation kinda makes it hard to keep teh awesome flowing. Sure, it's cool when someone does a backflip and kicks their opponent in the face, but when it's only doing 7 damage...yeah.

 

[ST]

But if all the "fun" comes from outside the book, then can you remind me what exactly it is that I'm buying?

Rules.

 

[Ariosto]

Dragonblade, your standard is D&D 3.5 -- but it's not mine. "Hasn't got as much Spam® in it as Spam® egg sausage and Spam®, has it?"

If a melee proceeds at slightly less glacial speed than in Champions or Star Fleet Battles, then that is faint praise -- or none at all, as it was designed to take so long in order to please players who like it that way.

Putting the rules for a scenario on loose-leaf pages does not reduce their number! Again, if one's frame of reference is a game in which a character sheet can fit on an index card, then the relative heaviness of 4E looks a bit different than if one is comparing it with WotC's previous release.

 

[Agamon]

I see the point being, regardless of system, you get out of it what you put into it. I agree with this. I'll add that different people want different things from the mechanics that a game runs on. What's fun is relative, but what is fact is that if you don't put some work into it, it'll be less fun than it could be.

 

[I'm A Banana]

What's fun is relative, but what is fact is that if you don't put some work into it, it'll be less fun than it could be.

Right. You work at your fun. I'ma go play WoW and have fun delivered to me for all the effort of simply pressing a button. Hope working hard for little real benefit works out for you.

I'm over-stating it, but as long as D&D requires lots of work, it's going to be something that not many people want to do, regardless of the edition.

 

[ggroy]

I'm over-stating it, but as long as D&D requires lots of work, it's going to be something that not many people want to do, regardless of the edition.

The original basic D&D box sets from the 1980's were simple enough to play, without requiring a lot of preparation and work.

 

[Agamon]

The "work" I do is pushing buttons, too. Maybe work is the wrong word. Time and/or care might be better.

 

[Imaro]

I don't mean to be a troll, but I think HP inflation kinda makes it hard to keep teh awesome flowing. Sure, it's cool when someone does a backflip and kicks their opponent in the face, but when it's only doing 7 damage...yeah.

This is definitely an interesting point. One of the first things one of my players said after we played 4e was (and yes, I'm paraphrasing)....

"Heroic, how is a 6'7, 300lb Dragonborn fighter in any way heroic when he's struggling to kill a 3'0 90lb mini-lizardman(Kobold Dragonshield). That ain't heroic, it's comedy."

...Hey, he had a point.