Why is it so important?

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Heroes in novels sometimes rest. Often enough, after a very hard fight or a long journey.

I don't know of novels that describe the reason for resting in any other way then being tired. Nowhere to they indicate that they do it because they are out of spells.

I think I had a few novels or movies in which the heroes were out of ammunition, but that rarely lead to them resting. Usually, they just have to switch to martial arts.

Oh, I think I remember one novel in which a Wizard didn't have the correct spell ready (which is not exactly "out of resources", it's more like "I forget my M16 Carbine at home") which also included a scene where one of the wizards said he was out of spells. But IIRC, they were using Wands (with limited charges, not their "inner" magical resource). And these scenes were all in a Discworld Novel, and I think my colleagues of the Unseen University and their magic is inspired by either Vance or D&D, possibly both, so I am not sure I can really count that.

 

[Raven Crowking]

However, I've never seen anyone use the excuse "We're out of fireballs for the day" or "I can't use healing magic again until tomorrow" as excuses.

In A Wizard of Earthsea by Ursula LeGuin, Ged (called Sparrowhawk) is chased by the Shadow, and unable to rest, until he finally runs out of magic. Then he finds a safe haven and rests until his magic is restored. This happens more than once in the novel.

Likewise, I have read several REH Conan stories in which a wizard uses magic, and then must rest before being able to use it again.


RC

 

[Raven Crowking]

Is there are reason you are not considering the possibility that per-day may be an obstacle to play which relies on other thresholds of significance, or which is not prudent, and that per-encounter might eliminate this obstacle?

Give me an example of a theshold of significance that per-day is an obstacle to. I note that by effectively using lower CR encounters (4 goblins vs 10th level fighter), per-day can actually model per encounter to some degree.

 

[Imaro]

In A Wizard of Earthsea by Ursula LeGuin, Ged (called Sparrowhawk) is chased by the Shadow, and unable to rest, until he finally runs out of magic. Then he finds a safe haven and rests until his magic is restored. This happens more than once in the novel.

Likewise, I have read several REH Conan stories in which a wizard uses magic, and then must rest before being able to use it again.


RC

Yeah, also Michael Moorcock's Elric, after performing certain acts of sorcery, must rest to regain his strength (or take drugs that replenish him).

 

[hong]

Give me an example of a theshold of significance that per-day is an obstacle to. I note that by effectively using lower CR encounters (4 goblins vs 10th level fighter), per-day can actually model per encounter to some degree.

Yes. By having boring fights.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Could you elaborate?

There are pages of elaboration available in this thread. I feel like I've already written a bloody thesis on this. And, frankly, should you not read what I've already written, or read it and go away unconvinced, it won't break my heart. Really, it won't.

It seems to me that we may be using "threat" in different senses. What I had in mind was an encounter in which, during any given round, the players are not confident that the use of per-day resource will not be required to succeed at the encounter - but which, through effective tactical play, ends up being won without the use of such resources.

This assumes that the players, being threatened by an encounter that they are not confident that they can win using per-encounter resources will wait to use per-day resources until they know that they have won, or that they are dead.

This is a very good example of a win/lose encounter, and prudent play would suggest (if you can rest to regain your per-encounter abilities thereafter) that you use whatever big guns you have, and then rest.

Of course, not everyone will play this way. Some DMs, realizing that this is happening, for example, will suggest making all per-day abilities per-encounter so that they automatically recharge without the extended rest period. Others will enforce strict time limits to prevent this sort of play. For some players, who do not care what is or is not prudent play, the issue will be a non-issue from the start.

I feel like I've already written a bloody thesis on this. And I (or others) have answered this specific claim dozens of times. I feel at this point that there is, simply put, no burden of proof that will satisfy.

RC

 

[Raven Crowking]

IMO his recent posts have been relatively cogent and non-argumentative, more of a "miniature platinum sword" spell component.

Not on the basis of what I've seen quoted.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Yeah, also Michael Moorcock's Elric, after performing certain acts of sorcery, must rest to regain his strength (or take drugs that replenish him).

Not unlike Underdog from the cartoon......

 

[hong]

Yeah, also Michael Moorcock's Elric, after performing certain acts of sorcery, must rest to regain his strength (or take drugs that replenish him).

Unless he rests for 8 hours, it doesn't count. And as said by M_R, resting because you're "tired" is not the same as resting because your magic mojo has run out.

(Per-encounter also involves resource depletion, don't forget.)

 

[hong]

Not on the basis of what I've seen quoted.

Tee hee!