D&D General Why is tradition (in D&D) important to you? [+]

[billd91]

what makes it wrong? roll 7d6 drop the lowest then apply -2 to all of them and assign where you want... I mean I have seen 100 different stat generating systems (Some don't even use dice but decks of cards) to generate 3-18... what makes 1 right and 1 wrong?

I assume very few people roll 3d6 place them as they get them... a few more roll 3d6 arrange to suit... but I assume most are rolling 4d6 drop the lowest and arrange to suit (I actually got to the point were I assumed with good evidence that a not negligible number where making up there own numbers or rerolling until they got what they wanted)

the answer of course, is exactly what we are talking about TRADITION

1d6-2 is a flat distribution with all results being equally likely, 3d6 generates a bell with -1, +0, +1, and +2 modifiers being significantly more likely than +3 and even more likely than +4. The former isn't a compatible replacement for the latter even if it covers a similar range.

 

[payn]

The more I hear about PF2, the less I ever want to play it.

Because they gone straight modifiers?

 

[Maxperson]

Because they gone straight modifiers?

Among other things that I've heard, yes.

 

[HammerMan]

1d6-2 is a flat distribution with all results being equally likely, 3d6 generates a bell with -1, +0, +1, and +2 modifiers being significantly more likely than +3 and even more likely than +4. The former isn't a compatible replacement for the latter even if it covers a similar range.

and 4d6 reroll 1's drop the lowest roll 7 numbers drop the lowest gives you a MASSIVE chance of having many PCs with 17+s... still see people do it... what does any of that have to do with 3-18? nothing.

tradition.

 

[billd91]

Sure there is. Just like with rock bands putting out albums that aren't expected to sell much.

It's the contrast between a money-first approach (write songs that market research shows will likely sell big) and a more artistic approach of simply writing good songs and having any money they bring in be a pleasant side effect.

Pretty much no musician, other than the fabulously wealthy and Harry from the Sultans of Swing (he's got a daytime job, he's doing alright), is putting out albums just for the art - they want to get paid. After all, they do have to put food on the table. They want to be able to make a living at their art.
This was actually a point of controversy for elements of the counterculture in the late 60s/early 70s who wanted all concerts to be free, man, and free from commercial sell-outs and with more artist integrity. Completely forgetting, of course, that artists need to eat and should be paid for their work.

 

[Sacrosanct]

how can you separate ANY item for sale from it's need to make money...

I mean is there ANY reason to put out ANY rpg if you don't want to sell it for money?

A lot of creators do this very thing in the RPG industry. The saying "if you want to end up with a million dollars making RPGs, start with 2 million" came about for a reason. Most indie creators just don't make money in this hobby. It's why we all have day jobs.

There are many products I've created and released knowing I'd never break even to what I spent on them, but I did so because it's fun to share ideas, and the best reward is seeing others having fun with something you created.

Right now, there are more than 12,000 free items on DTRPG. There seems to be a lot of evidence to counter your argument.

As an aside, in a + thread about tradition, you seem pretty intent on complaining about it. Do you know what a "+" indicator means? (not snarky, serious question).

 

[payn]

Among other things that I've heard, yes.

So I guess I ask myself what parts of tradition are valuable to me. For example, if folks wanted D&D to be an RPG based on Gundam suits i'd find that too far afield of tradition for my states. If you take a traditional mechanic and find a better way to use it, then im ok with that tradition getting a make over.

 

[ART!]

Tradition in D&D is important to me (insofar as it's important to me) because if I want to play something that doesn't feel like D&D then I will play something else.

That sounds very simplistic typing it out, but that's what it comes down to. Change "too many things" and at some point it won't feel like D&D to me.

Very little of my nostalgia or connection to D&D has to do with the mechanics, but I also know that for most of the people I have, do and will game with, those things are important, and so they're important to me.

 

[Maxperson]

So I guess I ask myself what parts of tradition are valuable to me. For example, if folks wanted D&D to be an RPG based on Gundam suits i'd find that too far afield of tradition for my states. If you take a traditional mechanic and find a better way to use it, then im ok with that tradition getting a make over.

For me it depends. Getting rid of stats and going straight bonus is going to ensure that I don't play the game. Taking stats and getting rid of penalties is a change that was acceptable to me. We're all going to be drawing these lines in different areas. There may be a tradition that I'll bend on that you won't.

 

[billd91]

and 4d6 reroll 1's drop the lowest roll 7 numbers drop the lowest gives you a MASSIVE chance of having many PCs with 17+s... still see people do it... what does any of that have to do with 3-18? nothing.

tradition.

With 6 stats and a die roll method that boosts the expected result to 12 instead of 10, sure, you do get things skewing a little higher and the chances of getting a 17+ in a stat do increase (I'd take issue with the claim of MASSIVE!!1!). But that doesn't approximate a flat distribution. The most frequent bonus will still be +1 and those are a lot more likely than +3 or +4. Either way, the assumption the rules make is that stats are distributed along something much closer to a normal distribution than a flat one.

And, while that is traditional, it's a pretty fundamental assumption throughout D&D character design that bonuses that deviate from +0 should be less frequent (rolled)/more expensive (bought with points) the better they are. Do you think there's something wrong with that design?