Why is WotC trying to kill my FLGS?

[catsclaw227]

FRP Games is an FLGS for someone, since they have a brick & mortar store, but they also have a pretty good online business. I used to buy from them all the time, especially 3rd party d20 content that I couldn't get on Amazon. It's been a long time, but I wonder how they are doing these days with the 3rd party market for d20 almost totally washed up (except for Paizo, who sells most of their own stuff from their own store).

 

[Rokes]

Sure you have a choice... Choose to not order out for pizza once, for example, and you'll have the spare money you need to buy it from your local store.

But pizza is delicious, and $15 in RPG books doesn't taste nearly as good. Trust me, I know um, a friend... who has tried!

 

[Turjan]

i'm going back to my main issue... unless local is also friendly why should I consider giving them my money? Helping the local economy is not a reason for me as a consumer to avoid getting the best price possible and stretching my dollar.

Yes, I guess that's the decision everyone has to make. I see the advantages of an LGS: Personally, I might have saved money by buying substantially less there, because I hesitate a bit more when buying in person than when I buy online. But that's a personal thing and not necessarily relevant to the discussion.

I have one LGS, and I have been there twice. The experiences were mixed. I buy stuff at amazon. I'd just like to add that not only the LGS are hurting.

A couple of weeks ago, I bought an RPG book (for Changeling) at my local Borders, which I usually don't do, but now did because I had a 40% off coupon. In the end, that's about the ballpark of the amazon price, if I take sales tax into account. Shortly thereafter, I got another one of their survey links, where they wanted to know how much I spend for books per year and what percentage I buy online and where online. I guess they didn't like the answer.

 

[Turjan]

FRP Games is an FLGS for someone, since they have a brick & mortar store, but they also have a pretty good online business. I used to buy from them all the time, especially 3rd party d20 content that I couldn't get on Amazon.

I still buy stuff for Ars Magica, Heroquest or other fringe stuff there.

 

[Fifth Element]

What about initial investment costs? R&D + Tooling Costs

Those would be included in the overhead, since they don't vary with the number of units produced.

 

[TheWinslow]

Ahhh.... so $15 isn't a big deal to you, but to many that like their game books and like to buy more than one, $10-$15 for each just might BE a big deal.

Ah, but once you have your books, do you have a place to use them or discuss them face-to-face?

I wouldn't. And, since I don't buy multiple copies of the same book, everything that comes out, or have the economic burdens some others might, buying online to save what amounts to half a tank of gas doesn't seem right.

I restate my earlier point: If you care enough to complain, If you want to keep your FLGS (assuming you have one), support them with your patronage. If not, then don't.

 

[justanobody]

WotC prices thing. That doesn't mean they know what it takes to run most LGS where shelf space is limited and buying in volume is not always the best thing.

The internet has taken over retail by storm.

I don't think it was done on purpose, but just wasn't noticed at what was really going on as the decline of the LGS continues in these hard economic times.

I am cheap. I will buy from the place that costs me less money. If an LGS wants to compete these days they have to offer incentives to buy from them over online competitors, and the online competitors have much more buying power and audience than a store or two that are competing only for local sales.

It also varies form LGS to LGS as to how much effort they really want to put into selling more. I know a few hat could care less to sell anything and just want to keep open so they have a place other than their own house to play games at.

As far as WotC setting a minimum price or price cap, that is price fixing, and illegal in the US. WotC could just limit to online retailers if they wanted to help the B&M stores, but that is lost profits for them.

The LGS just cannot compete with the volume. The wholesalers/distributors sadly prefer to sell in bulk as well. So the more you buy, the better chances of getting what you order will be.

You have to be able to get it to sale it, even before you can worry about competing with prices.

 

[Scribble]

Businesses stay in place because they offer their clients some sort of service or product that they are willing to pay for.

I know a lot of people argue that the FLGS offers more to the hobby as a whole then just a place to get their gaming stuff, but they still rely on the basic idea (selling product) to remain in business.

Maybe they should take a look at ways of taking these "features that help the gaming comunity" and using them to make a profit.

Maybe instead of a game store, offer a game club? A place where either for a modest membership fee, or some sort of use fee, the place would offer tables, terrain, books, sound tracks... With maybe food of some sort?

Hell maybe with enough business you could start offering DMs on staff. Like a gym offering a personal trainer.

I don't know if any of that would work, but my point is simply if the store's main focus (making money selling books) isn't working, it's time to rethink your business model.

Thinking about it, offer another area for console games too. Have a bunch of networked consoles ready with the latest "hot" games...

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

Ahhh.... so $15 isn't a big deal to you, but to many that like their game books and like to buy more than one, $10-$15 for each just might BE a big deal.


I have a wife and family, I support my mother-in-law and I have a hefty mortgage and two cars. I am the only bread-winner in our house. To be able to buy Martial Power, Draconomicon and Manual of the Planes for $64.51 (no shipping or sales tax) instead of $113.09 ($99.85 MSRP + $7.24 tax + $6 gas money), I can take the $49 and give it to my wife to buy something nice for herself (she likes skin care products and cosmetics), or even better, get a pack of 160 diapers for my daughter. It's not about buying one less pizza. It's about how the money gets shifted around our budget.

Seriously. Some of us don't have the luxury of blowing our money on pizza and beer. Some of us have to budget our money responsibly, and gaming stuff comes at the expense of important things. Every gaming book I buy is another $30 + compounded interest that doesn't go into my RESPs.

 

[justanobody]

Maybe instead of a game store, offer a game club? A place where either for a modest membership fee, or some sort of use fee, the place would offer tables, terrain, books, sound tracks... With maybe food of some sort?

I have suggested this before and here is the jist of what I was told....

We have to have the free space to get people in here to buy. Charging for space will only turn people away.

I told them....

Well it isn't like you will lose all your customers and the more room you have for product then the more things you can sell, so if some leave, reclaim the space for things other people will buy.

It could also help game stores cut down on bad clientele by having a "club".

Every week I hear about stolen cards from CCGs.

Charge people for lockers or something to store the stuff in rather than tripping over it on the floor, or taking up a whole gaming taming for their bags/boxes.

Also those club members could get discounts. There are tons of ways to do just that, but the stores I have seen are too lazy half the time to even be at the register to take money for purchases let alone these other things.

A few bad apples are affecting the whole bunch as bad stores drive more people to online sales, and those people tell their friends, and sales at even the good stores start to decline because of product+shipping is cheaper than going to buy it locally.

I only have WotC premium stores in may area and they are just bad places, so how can you get the stores to promote their own sales if they are recognized by someone as WotC, and there is no standards?

This is something WotC could help with, but it really isn't their job to keep the LGS in business anymore than it is the LGS to keep WotC in business.

So who does keeping the LGS open fall to?

-The LGS
-The game companies
-The consumers
-All of the above

I think full-size arcade games would work better than console games. But isn't a bad idea to bring the arcades back and use those to get sales of other things.