why not a grand mixology game?

Never, and I mean NEVER do I get more than an "uuuuummmm... let's play D&D!"

Is it ME? Is it something I SAID? These are the same people who don't do supers games for too-too long, and are a bit leery of star wars... but I'm just not sure these boards would fare much better. I've tried pbp offers on at least one forum, and possibly this one as well.

My opinion and experience, its not you, its D&D. D20 is not really all that good as a cross-genre platform (as evidenced by wounds/vitality and all sorts of klunks to get guns to work). D&D is its own investment and people want to play it. It requires deep system mastery, which keeps players from wanting to play other systems or genres. I know, I used throw up that same resistance you are getting.

So how to get what you want? Try Savage Worlds (there is even a setting like this - Savage Suzerain Review of Savage Suzerain - RPGnet). I have found where people will fight tooth and nail to only play D&D, they will set that aside when using something like Savage Worlds. I presume GURPS is an option as well. The hard part will be get your group to try a different system.
 

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But good point: what to do when the genres and materials literally clash! The Jedi lightsabre vs the Scorching Ray is a tricky question. I have two answers:

1) He-Man's sword would have deflected the ray as easily as a laser blast, and in their setting Jedi supposedly can do both blasters and force lightning, with the Force standing in for magic. Ergo, as the GM, I'd rule it would work.

2) However, I'm currently avoiding Star Wars because I think I've reached saturation for the franchise, and I'd disallow Jedi anyway! (possibly because I wanted so much from the series and it just isn't coming... like what the prequels could have been, or the novels, or how the canon is so crowded by going back in time and adding stories it's unrealistic, or how Darth Vader is some kind of uber messiah figure, etc, etc.)


Your point is more along the lines of a literal kitchen sink, though, as opposed to a specific setting with its own bounds that works

See? Now you're thinking with multigenre!

But seriously, we had characters that ranged from and through (covering 80 years of setting changes please realize):

a.) A Troll who proceeded to gain some semblance of taste and swagger through mental experimentation and became the dapper gentleman of the group for awhile in early games.
b.) A half-golem touring ball-player who used a magical version of Wonderboy as his weapon.
c.) A teddy bear infused with the spirit of... Gods, I can't remember who the heck it was, but who later 'retired' and became a pretty popular children's TV host.
d.) A disciple of Timothy Leary who took so many hallucinogens that he began warping spacetime through his mental gymnastics, doing impossible things (a nod to Madman from Simon R Green's The Nightside, where one specific player and I had way too much fun pulling weird pc materials)
e.) A carnival magician turned real mage when the tides began to rise up and magic came back into play from the Shadow during the Depression.
f.) A Drow who believed that blaxploitation and Chop Socky movies were literal interpretations of various cultures. He took his hair and developed a nice natural, began wearing gaudy flash clothes, and becoming a mix between the 18 Masters and Shaft/Dolemite.

They all played nice with regular Modern characters, and there wasn't an 'over the top' nature to any specific character.

Ahh, owe you an explanation: some monsters and fantasy creatures took to their new world, or began taking on various attributes. We had some Cyberscape creatures from various futuristic settings but they just don't stick out as much. Future tech came from various individuals including an Asian son of a spiritual healer and physicist who learned to pass through time and space with some mystically-manipulated physics quakery, but brought back some cool items and creations.

The WW2 plot focused around alien technology being brought back and the creation of multiple factions that brought various options into play. There were the British and their various mages from across the Empire, dustbowl hucksters a la Deadlands, the Germans creating warforged from the souls of Teutonic knights bound into armor manufactured by the Reich, and the Americans helping trapped rabbi and mystics to escape during the bombings of Dresden and leading to their own cybernetics in the field. We covered pretty much every possible mythology surrounding the various eras, and even included crossovers.

The 'new school' of mystic creatures began referring to the 'old school' elves and other denizens of Shadow as Tolkies somewhere around the 70s. It was humorous when we did get those who started out with very D&D-styled characters in Modern begin seeing the advantages/disadvantages of being D&D in Modern and changing their attitudes. To explain the whole thing in a post would be... Difficult :).

Slainte,

-Loonook.
 

At a certain point, I ask myself, "What the hell is this game about?" If the answer takes more than a sentence or two to explain to someone, it's too complicated.
I really like that closing sentence. Curiously, I made a blog post about theme and came to a similar conclusion just about a week or so ago. I agree 100%, and I think that's one of the biggest problems with a big "mixology" game. If what it's about is "jamming everything together from all kinds of genres and systems" then that's not a very compelling theme for a game, and ultimately compelling themes are the ones that get players excited.

If it's something more focused, like: "swashbuckling action meets horror and noir--think The Black Company and The Godfather meet Lovecraft, Sergio Leone and Pirates of the Caribbean", well hopefully that's a more compelling approach to a "weird" game.

http://darkheritage.blogspot.com/2012/02/campaign-themes.html
 
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My opinion and experience, its not you, its D&D... D&D is its own investment and people want to play it. It requires deep system mastery, which keeps players from wanting to play other systems or genres...

So how to get what you want? Try Savage Worlds...I have found where people will fight tooth and nail to only play D&D, they will set that aside when using something like Savage Worlds...

Good advice. I've encountered the same thing. I think it's more that d20 in another genre still "feels" like D&D to players, and we definitely have ideas about how D&D should "feel" that are at odds with different genres. While I believe d20 is a great engine to run games in other genres, it is easier to get past the D&D baggage with a switch to another game like Savage Worlds. It is certainly helped that Savage Worlds is an excellent multi-genre game in its own right.
 

Nice blog!

So maybe having a set genre idea that the characters have to accomplish would be good for the KS20 game.

Like how dungeoneering is the point of many D&D games, or the set piece that ties the whole thing together.

Would Shadowrun use the heist as a sort of dungeon? Like, you go in, defeat the security measures (troops, traps, etc.) and get out with the loot, then maybe run like heck.

Star Wars movies at least have that as a backdrop (ie: the Rebellion does that stuff off-screen) while they deal with father/son issues on screen. Maybe the sci-fi "mission" is the dungeon crawl of that type of game.

I suppose basking in the setting is what GMs do? (ie: look at all this neat stuff) But the game itself requires a mission or a dungeon or something. Maybe horror games and WoD games have a different set-up, either the mystery or the journey into darkness theme.
 

Nice blog!

So maybe having a set genre idea that the characters have to accomplish would be good for the KS20 game.

Like how dungeoneering is the point of many D&D games, or the set piece that ties the whole thing together.

Would Shadowrun use the heist as a sort of dungeon? Like, you go in, defeat the security measures (troops, traps, etc.) and get out with the loot, then maybe run like heck.

Star Wars movies at least have that as a backdrop (ie: the Rebellion does that stuff off-screen) while they deal with father/son issues on screen. Maybe the sci-fi "mission" is the dungeon crawl of that type of game.

I suppose basking in the setting is what GMs do? (ie: look at all this neat stuff) But the game itself requires a mission or a dungeon or something. Maybe horror games and WoD games have a different set-up, either the mystery or the journey into darkness theme.

I think you get to gauge player interest. I always took my cue from Men In Black: There is always some alien invasion force, a mad scientist ready to open a gate for the Old Ones, some mage leading cultists to take over the High Council... What are the players focused on?

The party is a group of individuals who make up one beacon in the weirdness of the Shadow. They need to know where the light is shining.

Slainte,

-Loonook.
 

The players don't know what you can throw at any one time and that lack of sureity makes them shy away from it. I had an epic party of players in a game that never materialized because I let it be known that they would have to visit the city of Mhegadon from Alternity: Tangents. They wanted their characters to be awesome and kick everyone's butt and they didn't know if they could fend off +5 blasters of distance wielded by high level fighters wearing +5 Fortified Battle Dress.

The same happened when I minmaxed the rules for the Mayfair's Roleaids: Dragons supplement for the biggest, baddest dragon on the planet when I had a character playing a 30th level Athasian Dragon basically shred a Great Wyrm red in a session. He wanted to be the biggest, baddest thing in the game and didn't want to deal with a Polymath (from the D&D Masters Rules) Dragon using the Roleaids and the Council of Wyrm rules. He just quit the game.
 

The players don't know what you can throw at any one time and that lack of sureity makes them shy away from it. I had an epic party of players in a game that never materialized because I let it be known that they would have to visit the city of Mhegadon from Alternity: Tangents. They wanted their characters to be awesome and kick everyone's butt and they didn't know if they could fend off +5 blasters of distance wielded by high level fighters wearing +5 Fortified Battle Dress.

The same happened when I minmaxed the rules for the Mayfair's Roleaids: Dragons supplement for the biggest, baddest dragon on the planet when I had a character playing a 30th level Athasian Dragon basically shred a Great Wyrm red in a session. He wanted to be the biggest, baddest thing in the game and didn't want to deal with a Polymath (from the D&D Masters Rules) Dragon using the Roleaids and the Council of Wyrm rules. He just quit the game.

This isn't really a point against a kitchen sink game, but moreso 'players who want to be way above all NPCs' problems. Also . . . Who quits a game over that? Tsk tsk...

Again, please try the Sink. The players can play in so many different genres with their characters, add little kinks, and it would be delightful!

Slainte,

-Loonook.
 

I suppose basking in the setting is what GMs do? (ie: look at all this neat stuff) But the game itself requires a mission or a dungeon or something. Maybe horror games and WoD games have a different set-up, either the mystery or the journey into darkness theme.
In my experience, setting is something that definitely turns on GMs moreso than players. (Sometimes writers too.) From a player's perspective, what makes the game interesting is their characters and the things that they get to do. Setting details are great, but they can't make a compelling game on their own, and front-loading a bunch of "wow, isn't this setting stuff neat?" information--sadly--in my experience will bore players long before it motivates them. Setting needs to be carefully doled out to players when appropriate, while the focus needs to be on characters.

That doesn't mean that cool settings can't exist, of course. What it does mean, though (IMO) is that trying to sell a game by selling the setting will rarely work, and as GM you have to be careful not to linger on showing off setting details too much.
 

If you are looking for a d20 game that can cover all those different settings and allow you to mix them then may I suggest my Nexus D20 game system. It is designed with that in mind.
 

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