Why Shouldn't I Ban "Come and Get It"?

[lostpike]

Would this take a creatue out of stealth? (especially a warlock using shadow walk hiding)

 

[Obryn]

Mind control isn't the only way to make people do what you want.

Yeah, it's like arguing that a Rogue in 3e couldn't Bluff a bad guy because "obviously, they wouldn't fall for it."

It's a game effect. Sometimes powers & abilities make creatures & PCs do things you don't think they would.

-O

 

[sidonunspa]

To the OP

Because in lord of the rings (fellowship of the rings) the orcs attacked Aragorn instead of running past him to get Frodo...

Because all the bad guys ran at Mad Martagin in Willow

Because all the guards attacked the sword master Indigo in The Princes Bride.

Because sometimes the warrior comes out to say.. Come get some!!.. And the bad guys (thinking they can take him down by sheer numbers) charge right at him, hoping to take down the wall that now stands before them.

 

[Mengu]

I'd probably do it as Charisma vs. Will.

I thought about that, but Charisma is not even a tertiary stat for a fighter, so I don't think it would be fair to have a fighter power which relies on charisma. After all a fighter making a charm attack with his weapon using strength is not much different than a paladin making a melee attack with his weapon using charisma.

Adding the charm keyword is a bad idea, IMHO. Consider your fighter in a battle against five or six strange, twisted, corrupted humanoids. He tries to goad them into approaching...

but they're foulspawn berserkers (MM p 112). Now, he takes 50 damage due the magical feedback caused by taunting.

Yes, that could be ugly (and the 10 points of damage he deals to each foulspawn is probably small consolation). But considering the higher level power Warrior's Urging is pretty much the same attack as Come and Get It except in a larger burst, and uses the Charm keyword, I don't think it's a bad idea.

 

[Mort_Q]

Mind control isn't the only way to make people do what you want.

Intriguing. Please, do explain.

 

[Maximillian]

Intriguing. Please, do explain.

The villain as forced the PCs into an arena, finding themselves surrounded by a crowd of chanting, bloodlusting onlookers. At his side, upon a grand balcony seat, or several dozen innocent children.

"Unless you'd like to see these orphan children burned to death, Sir Valiant, you'll do as I say and put on a little show for this crowd! You'll fight! Fight like your life depends upon it!"

We see this sort of thing in various action/adventure tales now and again. It's not really my style, but it's one way to make PCs fight.

I've had PCs come to blows over differing moral stances before, at that. Sometimes you don't even need to force their hands.

 

[James McMurray]

Intriguing. Please, do explain.

"Do what I say or I kill your mom."

There are countless other ways to coerce someone into doing something they wouldn't ordinarily do, many of which require no powers, skill checks, or any other game mechanics.

 

[GoLu]

The Sir Valiant example is interesting, but as PC or DM, I'd rather run that as a skill challenge where the two PCs pretend to fight until they can coordinate an escape plan that culminates in the two of them running off with armloads of orphans.

The other one seems like an intimidate check to me. Or maybe the start of a "rescue this person" adventure.

Plus, it's more than a little lame if the DM tosses the PCs into situations like that with no hope of escape and no recourse to alternate solutions. That's seriously like the Joker kidnapping Robin and telling Batman that he needs to kill Superman or Robin will die. What would Batman do? Kill Superman and beg the Joker for Robin's release? Hardly.

 

[Maximillian]

Plus, it's more than a little lame if the DM tosses the PCs into situations like that with no hope of escape and no recourse to alternate solutions.QUOTE]

Yeah, I'm in agreement here. My players would never forgive me for that.

Perhaps a better example would be one character under the influence of some paragon or epic level ritual causing them to see all their friends as enemies? (Via illusion.) I maintain there are plenty of possibilities.

I like your skill challenge idea, though.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Why should all enemies in the close burst 3 move adjacent to the tough looking weapon wielding fighter?

With martial exploits, it can help to visualize slide and pull effects as tactical manuevering. The fighter doesn't compell opponents to aproach him. He might manuever so that they're closer to him than they thought he'd be, apear vulnerable so they move in for the kill, or lash out boldly at those just out of reach leaving those who survive a chance to advance on him. Taunting, of course, is also just fine, if the fighter's the charismatic sort and it fits the nature of the opponents. You can visualize the same exploit differently depending on the situation and the nature of the enemies.