D&D 5E Why use initiative?

[Nebulous]

Yes, the simplicity of default initiative is a strength, easy to learn and implement. I would love to see a 5e style Arcana Unearthed toolkit book chock full of alternate ideas, like they did with 3e. I loved that book.

 

[Nebulous]

View attachment 152441

I never found it really bogged down the speed at all, personally, but of course everyone is different.

Yeah, I had completely forgotten about that page. It's been a minute.

 

[payn]

If I could automate this on a VTT id be much more likely to use it. One of the big bennies of VTT is it can help speed things like this up. When im face 2 face using battlematts and actual bones I go the most simple route.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Yeah, I had completely forgotten about that page. It's been a minute.

The tables of modifiers were on my DM screen, so it was never a hassle to check quickly to apply modifiers for me.

I'm glad 5E did something to offer for a variant in the DMG, even if people don't use it much.

 

[Scruffy nerf herder]

The tables of modifiers were on my DM screen, so it was never a hassle to check quickly to apply modifiers for me.

I'm glad 5E did something to offer for a variant in the DMG, even if people don't use it much.

Yep, we keep a Post-It Note visible for this purpose. The party doesn't have to think or spend time they simply play.

 

[Charlaquin]

While I do like this in concept, it doesn't seem like it would be any faster, but rather longer, than default initiative. I would have to playtest it. Have others tried it out? What was your experience?

I have. In my experience it’s not significantly slower or faster than default initiative. Re-rolling initiative at the start of each round does take up more time, but since players have to decide their actions with incomplete information during a shared action declaration phase, they tend in my experience to take less time analyzing all their options and just pick something to do. I haven’t timed it, but it feels like about the same amount of time per round. The difference is really more in gameplay feel than in table time. It makes combat feel much more chaotic. If you’re familiar with Final Fantasy games, I’d compare it to the difference between true turn based battles and the action timer battle system. Makes it feel like you don’t have the luxury of planning out the perfect move, you just have to pick something

 

[Rabulias]

Yes, this type of system has many variants and is a way of basically introducing speed factors without the modifiers being static, but replacing your d20 with other dice. IIRC I think there was even a UA on it called the Greyhawk Initiative variant, but I could be mistaken.

Your memory is not faulty: Greyhawk Initiative | Dungeons & Dragons

 

[Charlaquin]

I never tried it but it has always bothered me that ranged actions had the lowest modifier. That makes no sense to me, you need time to aim with a ranged attack that you don't with melee and it takes longer to get to its target! I would do it like:

d6 melee
d8 ranged
d10 magic

I think it’s supposed to model the range advantage. Because of the quirks of turn-based action, if you roll better initiative than the archer, you can run up to them before they’ve had a chance to shoot at no risk, whereas in real-time, there would be a significant risk in advancing towards that archer without covering fire. Giving ranged attacks an initiative advantage can help compensate for the discrepancy, kind of. That’s also why many speed factor initiative systems will give a similar (though usually smaller) advantage to reach weapons.

and maybe +d4 if you include movement.

Personally I prefer not to add a die for movement. Since it’s impossible to predict where everyone will be by the time your turn rolls around, declaring the move in case you need it is almost always the “correct” choice, so it functionally just ends up being +1d4 to everyone’s initiative. If anything, I would prefer to give an advantage to characters who opt not to move than penalize moving, since moving should be the default, IMO.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Your memory is not faulty: Greyhawk Initiative | Dungeons & Dragons

LOL that is good to know as I am approaching 50.

So, basically this is exactly what the OP is describing... nothing new, really, but fun if you get to see options in action.

 

[Charlaquin]

Second question. As a dm, How do you roll for multiple mobs? I mean, you have to decide if each one is 1) moving; 2) using melee or ranged or spellcasting.

that’s lots of individual decisions and rolling. Whereas, with traditional initiative, you could roll one d20 for the whole side, if you wanted to be quick.

When I’ve used this system, what I’ve done is roll once for each group of mobs that take the same action (or category of action). So, one roll for all the enemy archers, one for all the enemy casters, one roll for all the enemy melee combatants. I prefer not to add an extra die for movement, so that hasn’t been an issue for me. I suppose, if I wanted to add that factor in, I would have them move or not move in groups - either the enemy archers all stay in place, or the whole block takes the penalty so the units have the option to move if they need to.