Will this "attack combo" work (kinda Smack-downish)

[RigaMortus]

Human
Level 1 Fighter / Level 5 Rogue / Level 1 Sorcerer

Feats:
Combat Reflexes
Expert Tactician
Quicker Than The Eye
Sculpt Spell
Split Ray

Spells:
Level 0 - Daze, Detect Magic, Light, Ray of Frost
Level 1 - Color Spay, Shield

Weapon of choice:
Long-Spear (or something else with "reach")

Assuming I win initiative and foes are flat-footed

Round 1: Cast a Ray of Frost as a meta-magicked "split ray" at one opponent. In effect, opponet is hit by two rays. Would the damage from Sneak Attack (3d6) be carried over on both rays for a total of 1d3 (from Ray of Frost) and 6d6 (3d6 for each ray) damage?

Assuming I lose initiative and foe is no longer flat-footed. Also assuming I am 5' away from opponent (out of their threat range, but they are still in mine with my reach weapon).

On my turn, use "Quicker Than They Eye". If successful, I make a partial action to cast another "split ray" Ray of Frost. Since I am making an attack, opponent loses their Dex bonus and Ray of Frost is ranged touch attack, so effective AC would be 10 (against most opponents). Again, would I get the 3d6 for each ray that hits? Next, since the opponent lost their Dex bonus to AC, may I make another partial attack (because of Expert Tactician) using my Long Spear?

That about sums it up...

 

[Artoomis]

First, more than likely the Split Ray will not work to double damage against a single target. I'd need to see how Split Ray is set up first to be sure.

Thus you'd get only one sneak attack. I'd only let you get one in any case - even if get two rays, it's still one attack - kind of like shurikens.

That said, the basic idea of using a 0 level spell to get a touch attack, and thus multiple d6 damage from sneak attacks, is valid.

I'd have to review the whole "Quicker than the Eye" feat to see how it works to issue an opinion on that one.

 

[RigaMortus]

Here it is from the T&B

Split Ray [Metamagic]
You can affect two targets with a single ray.
Prerequisites: Any other metamagic feat.
Benefit: You can split spells that specify a single target and make a ranged touch attack. Only spells that deal damage can be affected by this feat. The split ray affects any two targets that are both within the spells range and within 30 feet of each other. Each target takes half as much damage as normally indicated (round down). If desired, you can have both rays attack the same target. A split ray uses up a spell slot of the spell's normal level, modified by any other metamagic feats.

Looking at this now, the very first sentance says "You can affect two targets with a SINGLE ray" so I can see your reasoning behind not allowing a Sneak Attack for each ray. But then, later in the description it says, "If desired, you can have BOTH rays attack the same target" suggesting that you are firing off two rays. If you were to fire off two arrows, would you not apply Sneak Attack to each arrow? How would this be any different?

 

[AGGEMAM]

1stly, Split Ray affect two targets equally much with one attack roll and rolling damage divided by two. So it's 1d3+3d6 to one target and that divided with two against two targets.

2ndly, Quicker than the Eye is not really dependant on you being within melee range to function. Although the extra attack from Expert Tactician is.

 

[Caliban]

Here it is from the T&B

Looking at this now, the very first sentance says "You can affect two targets with a SINGLE ray" so I can see your reasoning behind not allowing a Sneak Attack for each ray. But then, later in the description it says, "If desired, you can have BOTH rays attack the same target" suggesting that you are firing off two rays. If you were to fire off two arrows, would you not apply Sneak Attack to each arrow? How would this be any different?

You only apply your sneak attack damage once per attack.

When you fire two arrows you are making two seperate attacks and two seperate attack rolls.

When you throw three shuriken you are making a single attack, but with three attack rolls. The same thing holds true for the Fire Arrow spell, the various elemental Orb spells, and the the Split Ray feat.

When you Split a Ray, you are now making a single attack with two attack rolls. Only one of them will get the sneak attack damage.

 

[UofMDude]

If you were to fire off two arrows, would you not apply Sneak Attack to each arrow? How would this be any different?

True, but the sage has ruled in the past that spells that require a to-hit and affect multiple targets can only use the sneak attack damage for one of those "attacks" (the spellcaster picks one). I believe the example in question was the "orb" spells but I may be wrong on that.

Basically, a single spell is a single attack. Otherwise a spell that got 10-15 attacks would be obscene. It might not be totally unbalancing to let split ray work this way, but it would be a house rule.

UofMDude

 

[RigaMortus]

1stly, Split Ray affect two targets equally much with one attack roll and rolling damage divided by two. So it's 1d3+3d6 to one target and that divided with two against two targets.

Are you sure Sneak Attack also gets divided? If that is the case, would Sneak Attack damage be multiplied if I hit a crit?

As far as applying Sneak Attack only once, I forgot about the whole Shuriken debate. I can see where this type of thing would be compared to throwing multiple Shurikeens.

 

[jontherev]

On my turn, use "Quicker Than They Eye". If successful, I make a partial action to cast another "split ray" Ray of Frost. Since I am making an attack, opponent loses their Dex bonus and Ray of Frost is ranged touch attack, so effective AC would be 10 (against most opponents). Again, would I get the 3d6 for each ray that hits? Next, since the opponent lost their Dex bonus to AC, may I make another partial attack (because of Expert Tactician) using my Long Spear?

That about sums it up...

As soon as you attack, your foe loses their dex, with regards to YOU only. This is assuming you were successful with QttE. If so, it triggers your extra attack from ET, IF you are within melee range (and you are in this example). However, THIS attack your opponent sees just in time to retain their dex bonus, since bluffing only works for ONE attack, so no sneak attack. It's a good tactic, but the ray isn't really necessary. Now, if you were Imp. Inv. and had foes coming at you, you'd be getting sneak AoO's left and right.

 

[Don21584]

I believe the PH says that Sneak Attack never gets crit multiplied damage.

 

[AGGEMAM]

Are you sure Sneak Attack also gets divided? If that is the case, would Sneak Attack damage be multiplied if I hit a crit?

As far as applying Sneak Attack only once, I forgot about the whole Shuriken debate. I can see where this type of thing would be compared to throwing multiple Shurikeens.

No, I'm not sure. But the 1st line troubles me.

'You can split spells that specify a single target and make a ranged touch attack.'

What the heck do they mean by that.

Possible interpretations include:

1) Specify two targets and make a single ranged touch attack roll.
2) You can split spells that specify a single targets and a ranged touch attack.
3) Specify two targets and make two ranged touch attack rolls.

Only option 1) actually conforms with the wording of the feat.