WotC Wizard's Future Plans Has 3 Big Problems: Ft. The Professor of Tolarion Community College

[Maxperson]

They didn't support them like they did in 2e, where settings became their own ecosystems with numerous publications just for specific settings. Not even close. There's nothing in 3e or 4e that approaches 2e Dark Sun, for example, in terms of changes to the base game or the publication of additional content. 4e Dark Sun is a pale shadow (heh) of its 2e antecedent.

3e Forgotten Realms and Eberron both have more content made for them by WotC than 2e made for Dark Sun.

 

[darjr]

It is ironic that the new pace from WotC is considered way too fast. It's practically anemic compared to earlier editions and even to Paizo during PF 1.

But I also think the previous slow release cycle with an emphasis on a season shared by many in the community was one of the gems of WotC 5e D&D.

 

[Maxperson]

It is ironic that the new pace from WotC is considered way too fast. It's practically anemic compared to earlier editions and even to Paizo during PF 1.

But I also think the previous slow release cycle with an emphasis on a season shared by many in the community was one of the gems of WotC 5e D&D.

I'll disagree with you about the slow release. Slower is good. Too slow(which is what we had) was not so good. The new rate seems to be okay, but the quality of books(Spelljammer had like 10 pages of actual setting in it) has plummeted.

 

[darjr]

I'll disagree with you about the slow release. Slower is good. Too slow(which is what we had) was not so good. The new rate seems to be okay, but the quality of books(Spelljammer had like 10 pages of actual setting in it) has plummeted.

But therin lies the problem I think.

I suspect that they are trying to squeze out more books but with the same investment of time and effort. If that makes sense?

 

[Maxperson]

But therin lies the problem I think.

I suspect that they are trying to squeze out more books but with the same investment of time and effort. If that makes sense?

Yep. They are being greedy and it's going to backfire on them. They could make this pace and still put out quality stuff if they wanted to, and still make a lot of profit.

 

[darjr]

Also I think they wanted to experiment with the kind and way they release things. some of them are going to fail.

 

[darjr]

Yep. They are being greedy and it's going to backfire on them. They could make this pace and still put out quality stuff if they wanted to, and still make a lot of profit.

it occours to me that they could also support the "Seasonality" of the past at this pace. Imagine if books supported the season and/or they focused on one of the books for the season.

 

[Maxperson]

it occours to me that they could also support the "Seasonality" of the past at this pace. Imagine if books supported the season and/or they focused on one of the books for the season.

I'm not sure what you mean by season.

 

[darjr]

I'm not sure what you mean by season.

It used to be there was a book/adventure and WotC focused AL on it and other resources. So it became like a season of television and large groups of the community would have this commonality and bounce ideas and see how others ran it or played in it.

Now they chop up that focus accross several unrealted books and it dilutes the focus of a book quickly.

anyway I thought it was a good idea, and I think individual adventures sold better because of it. I think I can see that in the Amazon numbers.

 

[Maxperson]

It used to be there was a book/adventure and WotC focused AL on it and other resources. So it became like a season of television and large groups of the community would have this commonality and bounce ideas and see how others ran it or played in it.

Now they chop up that focus accross several unrealted books and it dilutes the focus of a book quickly.

anyway I thought it was a good idea, and I think individual adventures sold better because of it. I think I can see that in the Amazon numbers.

Are you saying like they would focus a season on Forgotten Realms products and then another season on Eberron, then maybe make some Greyhawk books for a season?

 

[darjr]

Are you saying like they would focus a season on Forgotten Realms products and then another season on Eberron, then maybe make some Greyhawk books for a season?

Like when they released Hoard of the Dragon Queen the AL "season" was focused on dealing with the Dragon cult and it's machinations. Albeit across a different part of the realms. But the PR was focused on that book too. And a lot of players were playing through it simultaneously. Especially as a book in AL.

Same with Princes, and the other early adventure books.

 

[Maxperson]

No. Like when they released Hoard of the Dragon Queen the AL "season" was focused on dealing with the Dragon cult and it's machinations. Albeit across a different part of the realms. But the PR was focused on that book too. And a lot of players were playing through it simultaneously. Especially as a book in AL.

Same with Princes, and the other early adventure books.

Okay. I understand what you are saying. That would be good for them to do, but I also like the increased release rate. It doesn't have to be 3e/4e speeds of release, but as you said in your prior post, the old rate was anemic.

 

[Parmandur]

My perception thus far is that most players liked the Spelljammer slipcase, and it was mostly in the circles of folks who have old edition books on their shelves that didn’t like how lore-lite it is and trash it on that basis.

The actual product is quite good, the only content problem I’ve seen was the hadozee, and most groups don’t use lore as written anyway.

The quality is good: I do feel that if the total page count was closer to 320 pages than 192, it could have been stronger, but what is there is great.

 

[Parmandur]

Are you saying like they would focus a season on Forgotten Realms products and then another season on Eberron, then maybe make some Greyhawk books for a season?

The way they did it in the past was tying Adventurer's League material to the bug Adventure releases. That started getting looser the DMsGuild basically made every release an evergreen source of third party material in their walled garden.

 

[Maxperson]

The way they did it in the past was tying Adventurer's League material to the bug Adventure releases.

Thri-kreen. Got it.

But seriously now. I understand and think that's a good idea. Personally I won't touch AL with a 10 foot pole, but it's pretty popular from what I understand and that kind of tie in would make sense from a business standpoint. The players and DMs would want to buy the books for that season.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

And then folks wonder why people look at the current 5e as the 'white bread' of even D&D, let alone RPGs.

More like sourdough.

There’s no reason to complicate sourdough. It works great with a bunch of different dishes and by itself, and it doesn’t, as the Irish say, have any notions.

 

[Scribe]

More like sourdough.

There’s no reason to complicate sourdough. It works great with a bunch of different dishes and by itself, and it doesn’t, as the Irish say, have any notions.

Hey, I'll eat white bread. It is what it is.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

The quality is good: I do feel that if the total page count was closer to 320 pages than 192, it could have been stronger, but what is there is great.

Yeah I just feel like it’s a “setting” that is easy to bounce off of, more so the more details are in the main book for it.

And tbh I prefer having semi-official deep dives by original creators on DMsGuild, but the official material is quite light.

But hey, I’m basically only ever going to use Eberron (mostly) as written, the rest of my games just borrow elements from published settings, at most.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

@Scribe

Sure, I just disagree with the characterization.

IMO it’s a good thing that 5e setting books are light manuals on running games with certain themes and assumptions that differ from the standard. I’d rather have that than the splintered lines of 2e or even the hodgepodge of 3.5 or the constant flow of new lore from 4e.

 

[Parmandur]

Yeah I just feel like it’s a “setting” that is easy to bounce off of, more so the more details are in the main book for it.

And tbh I prefer having semi-official deep dives by original creators on DMsGuild, but the official material is quite light.

But hey, I’m basically only ever going to use Eberron (mostly) as written, the rest of my games just borrow elements from published settings, at most.

Really it just felt like some Adventure building tables, or extended system building guidance would have pushed it from a base hit to a home run for me.