Would anyone prefer spellcasting to stay as it is?

[Horacio]

I've just discovered a post of Monte Cook about the subject, and I'm amazed of how it is similar to what we have been told about 4e :

http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?otherd20_Spellcasters

I wonder if it is a case of parallel thinking or if the idea was turning in WotC R&D team for a while

 

[catsclaw227]

I am guessing that arcanists will get a blaster ability like the warlock, or some magical maneuvers like martial characters got in B09S, but that they will have a spell book or a vancian pool of spells for utility, uncommon situations or non-encounter situations.

 

[Brother MacLaren]

I love Vancian magic, it's one of the quirks of D&D. I love the challenge of resource management and judgement that it brings, and I don't mind NOT casting a spell on my turn if the fight is well in hand. 4E wizards are sounding less and less appealing.

 

[Goken100]

Definition of Vancian Magic

For those of you that don't know, here's the history of spell memorization:

1. In 1950 an author named Jack Vance published the novel "The Dying Earth".
2. In 1974 Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson borrowed the spell memorization concept from Vance when they produced a game called Dungeons and Dragons.

That's the whole thing! It's high time "Vancian Magic" became the alternate rule it was destined to be. It does not simulate the huge, vast, gigantic, enormous majority of mythology and fiction in the slightest. The only people that like it (or even understand it) are gamer nerds like us, and the future of D&D is the next generation.

 

[Korgoth]

One thing about "Vancian" magic: As much as I think that the traditional D&D spellcasting works fine in most places (though the point about low level casters having 1 combat and then wanting to rest is well taken), it isn't really all that Vancian.

In Vance, even a very accomplished mage can only memorize like 4 spells (archmages are different because they get extraplanar entities to do their magical grunt work, but that's a later concept from Vance and the original stories didn't include such notions). Each of the 3-5 spells they can "encompass", however, will tend to be a doozy: we're talking like 7th-9th level spells probably in D&D terms. The "Excellent Prismatic Spray" is way better than the 'Dinky Prismatic Spray' of D&D: the EPS is basically the magical equivalent of getting riddled with bullets from a .50 caliber machinegun. It royally wastes whatever it hits, and there may not even be a prospect of it missing. Likewise, "Phandal's Gyrator" and others. It isn't really a "hit or miss" proposition as far as I can tell, except when a goof like Cugel (a thief and dabbler, not a wizard) just tries to read a spell aloud without really knowing what he's doing (and almost always gets it backwards).

Nor is there any evidence that you could 'memorize' a Vancian spell more than once. And again, there isn't anything like "light" or "read magic" or whatnot, or even "Magic Missile": we're talking more like "Magic Intercontinental Ballistic MIRV". Even the mightiest princes are afraid of middling-level wizards since each is likely to have at least one insta-kill up his sleeve.

I'm anxious to see whether I'll like the changes they're making. I have nothing against the present system in principle. However, the present system is at best "quasi-Vancian".

 

[Mortellan]

As long as healers must learn spells like wizards and not have access to everything in print, I'll be happy.

 

[JDJblatherings]

For those of you that don't know, here's the history of spell memorization:

1. In 1950 an author named Jack Vance published the novel "The Dying Earth".
2. In 1974 Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson borrowed the spell memorization concept from Vance when they produced a game called Dungeons and Dragons.

That's the whole thing! It's high time "Vancian Magic" became the alternate rule it was destined to be. It does not simulate the huge, vast, gigantic, enormous majority of mythology and fiction in the slightest. The only people that like it (or even understand it) are gamer nerds like us, and the future of D&D is the next generation.

actually Dave Arneson didn't use a strict 'Vancian Magic" system at first. He used a system where MUs could prepare any spell they knew(at a cost) and could go in with as many as he had time and GP to ready.At least that s what one gets reading First Fantasy campaign.

 

[Quartz]

I've no problem with the current system. What I do see is too few mages creating scrolls, potions etc. A wizard should be a walking library of scrolls, a walking fountain of potions, and a walking arsenal of wands. Memorise those spells you expect to use; have scrolls (or potions or wands...) of those you don't expect to use. And have more scrolls of those you expect to use too.

 

[F4NBOY]

I've no problem with the current system. What I do see is too few mages creating scrolls, potions etc. A wizard should be a walking library of scrolls, a walking fountain of potions, and a walking arsenal of wands. Memorise those spells you expect to use; have scrolls (or potions or wands...) of those you don't expect to use. And have more scrolls of those you expect to use too.

I could have a better and simpler mechanic to create scrolls, wans and potions...
Calculating the cost of a scroll or wand is very simple, but when your in the middle of a session, your wizards wants to create 10 scrolls of shield level 6, 20 scrolls of MM level 5, a wand of true strike, a wand of burning hands lvl 5, 5 scrolls of fireball level 6, 2 scrolls for each +4 to ability spells level 6, 4 potions of invisibilty level 1, 5 scrolls fo dispel magic level 6, things can get a little bogged down.

 

[Brennin Magalus]

I would like to see 4E drop the wizard and combine psions and sorcerers into one class.