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Pyrex said:
I just came across this and was about to post it, but after checking it turns out you had beaten me to it.
Good quality writing and funny too.
Writers strike is a go
- Thread starter Grog
- Start date
I just came across this and was about to post it, but after checking it turns out you had beaten me to it.
Good quality writing and funny too.
Mistwell
Crusty Old Meatwad
Producer's Guild just posted this opinion piece from the LA Times on their website.
http://www.amptp.org/
Los Angeles Times | Opinion
Can the strike be settled?
Cut the theatrics, say the producers.
By Nick Counter on November 17, 2007
Producers in Hollywood absolutely believe that writers should be compensated for their work in new media. They also believe writers deserve to share in whatever success new technologies bring to studios. Producers have already put their money where their mouth is by paying millions in residuals for permanent and pay-per-view downloads.
Unfortunately, the theatrics and carefully designed photo opportunities of the last two weeks have obscured the fact that the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers clearly supports writers having a fair share in opportunities presented by digital distribution.
The leaders of the Writers Guild of America know that during the last bargaining session Nov. 4, the producers proposed a residual rate for streaming shows and offered WGA members exclusivity in writing derivative programming made for new media — two proposals that were of utmost importance to WGA members — in order to make a deal that was fair to all. Unfortunately, the WGA leadership went on strike while that offer was on the table, ending negotiations.
What the WGA leadership is really asking for strains the test of reasonableness, and the problem is that few people outside the bargaining room know what’s actually at issue.
In short, the guild is demanding an unjustifiable increase in the residual rate that writers receive for downloads, money they receive in addition to the salary they were paid in the first place (the WGA’s 4,434 working members make an average of $200,000 per year). They are also demanding a percentage of the advertising revenue earned by the networks from ad-supported streaming.
However, the WGA’s contract is not with networks, it is with producers, who receive no proceeds from these advertisements, just as they receive none of the revenue achieved by networks through commercial television.
And what they don’t want their membership and the public in general to focus on is that it’s the producers who shoulder all the risk in a business in which most motion pictures lose money, and the vast majority of television shows either never get past the pilot episode or never achieve profitability.
Regardless of whether a show or a movie is a hit or a flop, the writer is paid.
In addition, members of the Writers Guild and its sister guilds are covered by the country’s finest healthcare and pension plans, and our contribution to those plans has consistently increased while other industries’ contributions have decreased.
Further, the economics of the media business are changing. Producers are faced with soaring production and marketing costs, a DVD business that is to the Internet, a softening syndication market and an increasingly fragmented advertising and viewing landscape — all of which are creating real challenges that everyone in this business is facing.
It’s unfortunate that this wholly unnecessary strike is threatening to financially devastate the hundreds of thousands of people in the Southland whose livelihoods depend on a thriving and working industry. It must end, and end soon.
What will it take to end the strike and to get the contract resolved?
The AMPTP is prepared to negotiate if the Writers Guild sincerely expects that a deal can be made. It’s time to stop the posturing and the mischaracterization of positions and get on with the hard work ahead of us.
The WGA has to start dealing with the 21st century realities of our business so that we can craft a new contract that protects the interests of all entertainment industry employees.
We’ve accomplished this in the past. We can do it again.
http://www.amptp.org/
Los Angeles Times | Opinion
Can the strike be settled?
Cut the theatrics, say the producers.
By Nick Counter on November 17, 2007
Producers in Hollywood absolutely believe that writers should be compensated for their work in new media. They also believe writers deserve to share in whatever success new technologies bring to studios. Producers have already put their money where their mouth is by paying millions in residuals for permanent and pay-per-view downloads.
Unfortunately, the theatrics and carefully designed photo opportunities of the last two weeks have obscured the fact that the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers clearly supports writers having a fair share in opportunities presented by digital distribution.
The leaders of the Writers Guild of America know that during the last bargaining session Nov. 4, the producers proposed a residual rate for streaming shows and offered WGA members exclusivity in writing derivative programming made for new media — two proposals that were of utmost importance to WGA members — in order to make a deal that was fair to all. Unfortunately, the WGA leadership went on strike while that offer was on the table, ending negotiations.
What the WGA leadership is really asking for strains the test of reasonableness, and the problem is that few people outside the bargaining room know what’s actually at issue.
In short, the guild is demanding an unjustifiable increase in the residual rate that writers receive for downloads, money they receive in addition to the salary they were paid in the first place (the WGA’s 4,434 working members make an average of $200,000 per year). They are also demanding a percentage of the advertising revenue earned by the networks from ad-supported streaming.
However, the WGA’s contract is not with networks, it is with producers, who receive no proceeds from these advertisements, just as they receive none of the revenue achieved by networks through commercial television.
And what they don’t want their membership and the public in general to focus on is that it’s the producers who shoulder all the risk in a business in which most motion pictures lose money, and the vast majority of television shows either never get past the pilot episode or never achieve profitability.
Regardless of whether a show or a movie is a hit or a flop, the writer is paid.
In addition, members of the Writers Guild and its sister guilds are covered by the country’s finest healthcare and pension plans, and our contribution to those plans has consistently increased while other industries’ contributions have decreased.
Further, the economics of the media business are changing. Producers are faced with soaring production and marketing costs, a DVD business that is to the Internet, a softening syndication market and an increasingly fragmented advertising and viewing landscape — all of which are creating real challenges that everyone in this business is facing.
It’s unfortunate that this wholly unnecessary strike is threatening to financially devastate the hundreds of thousands of people in the Southland whose livelihoods depend on a thriving and working industry. It must end, and end soon.
What will it take to end the strike and to get the contract resolved?
The AMPTP is prepared to negotiate if the Writers Guild sincerely expects that a deal can be made. It’s time to stop the posturing and the mischaracterization of positions and get on with the hard work ahead of us.
The WGA has to start dealing with the 21st century realities of our business so that we can craft a new contract that protects the interests of all entertainment industry employees.
We’ve accomplished this in the past. We can do it again.
WayneLigon
Adventurer
The strike is obviously still ongoing. The latest news is here..
From ComicBookResources:
The late night scene is getting more complicated, as Variety talks about Jay Leno's attempts to ease the financial burdens of his staff out of his own pocket, despite not owning his show as Letterman does (and some have accused Leno of cheaping out).
The networks aren't taking the strike lying down, as is reported in this New York Times article: "NBC has made an ambitious deal, apparently the first of its kind, to buy a two-hour -- or perhaps even three-hour -- block of prime-time programming from outside producers, ... This would be cheaper than both scripted and reality programming. Crafty.
Finally, we received an email from "R. Pincombe" who wrote, "I'm afraid it's innacurate [sic] to say that Canadian are striking in solidarity with the WGA. We held our troubled negotiations over many of these same issues earlier this year (We voted to strike also but negotiations resumed) and now have a signed agreement in place with CANADIAN producers and we must honour [sic] that. However, we will NOT work on any US based shows, some of which are produced here or have Canadian ties. We are also demonstrating at various locales in solidarity. We have also united with the writer's guilds and unions of other countries to pledge our support and attempt to raise awareness of the issues. Other ways to help the WGA are being discussed." So there you have it.
From ComicBookResources:
The late night scene is getting more complicated, as Variety talks about Jay Leno's attempts to ease the financial burdens of his staff out of his own pocket, despite not owning his show as Letterman does (and some have accused Leno of cheaping out).
The networks aren't taking the strike lying down, as is reported in this New York Times article: "NBC has made an ambitious deal, apparently the first of its kind, to buy a two-hour -- or perhaps even three-hour -- block of prime-time programming from outside producers, ... This would be cheaper than both scripted and reality programming. Crafty.
Finally, we received an email from "R. Pincombe" who wrote, "I'm afraid it's innacurate [sic] to say that Canadian are striking in solidarity with the WGA. We held our troubled negotiations over many of these same issues earlier this year (We voted to strike also but negotiations resumed) and now have a signed agreement in place with CANADIAN producers and we must honour [sic] that. However, we will NOT work on any US based shows, some of which are produced here or have Canadian ties. We are also demonstrating at various locales in solidarity. We have also united with the writer's guilds and unions of other countries to pledge our support and attempt to raise awareness of the issues. Other ways to help the WGA are being discussed." So there you have it.
Storm Raven
First Post
Mistwell said:
And on this, you are just flat wrong.
It is not a concern for the writers. A writer is much like any other worker working for another. He puts in his input, but the entity producing the final overall product is the entity that has the responsibility to make the product profitable or not. Does GM ask the line workers at their factories to make sure their cars sell for a profit? No, they don't, and the line worker doesn't really care either. It is up to GM to make the cars turn a profit, and GM alone.
They can, and do, make movies that cost far less than the "average" given. Hence, there is prima facie evidence that Hollywood producers could control costs if they truly wanted to. But they don't. Watching the production process of a Hollywood movie is often like watching a drunken sailor on payday. I don't have a lot of sympathy for hungover sailors with no money the next day.
Cherry picking a single example doesn't make your case. The reality is that I ignored your anecdotal data because it is completely worthless.
Now you are pretending I made an argument I didn't make. I said that if the studios wanted to, they could structure their costs to make a profit on just the theatrical release. No one said to compartmentalize the profits, because the profits don't really matter in this dispute. Only the revenues. You see, writers are a cost, not a partner in a profit sharing plan.
You are wrong. The artist is a cost for you. And the cost is 4.5%. Not 50%. The artist doesn't care what your profit is, he cares what your revenue is. He wants a share of the total revenue, not your profit, because he has no control over how you control your other costs.
This is very basic economics. Expected revenues grow - in this case, they grew because of the previously untapped market of DVD sales. Studios anticipate the increasde in revenues, and change their behaviour accordingly, greenlighting budgets based upon these expected increased revenues. Costs grow to meet the increased revenues, because studios decide that they can get away with paying the increased costs as a result. Costs generally increase to meet expected revenues, not the other way around. Studios could take a more conservative approach and not raise their costs as much, or to include the cost of writer residuals in those calculations. As of yet, they haven't.
We have a hundred years of pre-DVD movie and television productions that somehow survived. Look at, for example, Hill Street Blues, now available on DVD. Is the revenue stream from that anything other than a huge windfall? Now, someone was able to make that show originally without anticipating the after market, and somehow make it profitable. Are you saying that modern production companies aren't as skilled at dealing with costs as they were circa the early 198os?
That they understand enough to publicly state they anticipate billions in revenue from it. And tell that to their stockholders. And the loss (if there is a loss) is their own damn fault. I can't be any clearer on this. When your costs exceed the expected revenues from your product on a regular basis you are doing something wrong. When it is an industrywide phenomenon, your industry is behaving stupidly. Expecting the writers to pick of the slack for your stupid decisions is just idiotic.
Your arguments still don't make sense because you have cause and effect backwards.
Mistwell
Crusty Old Meatwad
DGA just reached a deal with the producers. Which means the WGA is probably toast. DGA got done in 6 days what WGA has failed to be able to do in many months. With the DGA defecting, it likely means SAG will crack the same deal, and WGA will have to give up the strike or accept that deal as well. But with the money they have lost with this strike, they cannot possibly hope to make up that lost revenue over the 3 years of the new deal.
My guess is the strike will end in a month or less.
My guess is the strike will end in a month or less.
Silver Moon
Adventurer
Agreed, once one union deals the others will fall in line or be left out in the cold - writers will settle or their union will cease to exist - no other real alternatives from what I see.Mistwell said:
Cthulhudrew
First Post
Crap. WGA dropped it's Reality TV demands. Looks like they figured it was better to cave on that one (for now) while sticking to their guns on the royalties issue.
Last edited:
Relique du Madde
Adventurer
Cthulhudrew said:
Damn. And I was hoping that this year would bring forth all sorts of British television to the US.
Mistwell
Crusty Old Meatwad
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/02/b...en=bdf485ec2a348d98&ei=5099&partner=TOPIXNEWS
Deal to End Hollywood Writers’ Strike May Be Near
By MICHAEL CIEPLY
Published: February 2, 2008
LOS ANGELES — Informal talks between representatives of Hollywood’s writers and production companies eliminated the major roadblocks to a new contract, opening the prospect of a tentative agreement between the parties as early as next week, according to people who were briefed on the situation but requested anonymity because they were not authorized to speak.
A deal would end a crippling writers strike that is now entering its fourth month.
The agreement may come without renewed formal negotiations between the parties, though both sides still need to agree on specific language of key provisions. If that process goes smoothly, an agreement may be presented to the governing boards of the striking Writers Guild of America West and Writers Guild of America East by the end of next week, the people said.
The breakthrough occurred Friday after two weeks of closed-door discussions between the sides. Even if approved by leaders of the guilds, a deal would require ratification by a majority of the more than 10,000 active guild members.
Writers walked out on Nov. 5 after failing to reach a new contract with producers in months of difficult bargaining. Talks resumed briefly in December, but quickly broke off again. The latest round of talks came in the wake of a tentative contract agreement between producers and the Directors Guild of America.
That deal confronted many of the same issues that have troubled writers — including difficult questions related to pay for digital distribution of shows and movies — and paved the way for Friday’s movement toward a deal.
A final sticking point had been compensation for television programs that are streamed over the Internet after their initial broadcast. Companies were seeking a period during which they could stream such shows without paying a residual, and wanted to peg payments for a year of streaming at the $1,200 level established in the directors’ contract. Writers were seeking 1.2 percent of the distributors’ revenue from such streams as a residual. How that issue was finally resolved in the informal talks remained unclear as of Saturday afternoon.
Spokesmen for the West Coast writers guild and the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers did not immediately respond to requests for comment. The sides have been operating under a news blackout.
Deal to End Hollywood Writers’ Strike May Be Near
By MICHAEL CIEPLY
Published: February 2, 2008
LOS ANGELES — Informal talks between representatives of Hollywood’s writers and production companies eliminated the major roadblocks to a new contract, opening the prospect of a tentative agreement between the parties as early as next week, according to people who were briefed on the situation but requested anonymity because they were not authorized to speak.
A deal would end a crippling writers strike that is now entering its fourth month.
The agreement may come without renewed formal negotiations between the parties, though both sides still need to agree on specific language of key provisions. If that process goes smoothly, an agreement may be presented to the governing boards of the striking Writers Guild of America West and Writers Guild of America East by the end of next week, the people said.
The breakthrough occurred Friday after two weeks of closed-door discussions between the sides. Even if approved by leaders of the guilds, a deal would require ratification by a majority of the more than 10,000 active guild members.
Writers walked out on Nov. 5 after failing to reach a new contract with producers in months of difficult bargaining. Talks resumed briefly in December, but quickly broke off again. The latest round of talks came in the wake of a tentative contract agreement between producers and the Directors Guild of America.
That deal confronted many of the same issues that have troubled writers — including difficult questions related to pay for digital distribution of shows and movies — and paved the way for Friday’s movement toward a deal.
A final sticking point had been compensation for television programs that are streamed over the Internet after their initial broadcast. Companies were seeking a period during which they could stream such shows without paying a residual, and wanted to peg payments for a year of streaming at the $1,200 level established in the directors’ contract. Writers were seeking 1.2 percent of the distributors’ revenue from such streams as a residual. How that issue was finally resolved in the informal talks remained unclear as of Saturday afternoon.
Spokesmen for the West Coast writers guild and the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers did not immediately respond to requests for comment. The sides have been operating under a news blackout.
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