You can't go back. Or can you?

I'm currently playing in "Keep on the Borderlands" in an online game and enjoying it very much.

I have run 3e conversion of U1-3 ("Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh" trilogy) and G1 (at Christmastime for my kids and brother). All were a lot of fun. I had run G1-3 when they first came out, but never U1-3.

About 2 years ago, I played in a one-shot AD&D night, where our DM ran S1 ("Tomb of Horrors"). It was fun as a one-shot, but that sort of 'dungeon of doom'/'kill the PCs' is not something I'd want to play in for an extended campaign.
 

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drnuncheon said:
The Saltmarsh modules, OTOH, seem to hold up fairly well.

I'm sorry, but: Bwah-ha ha ha ha ha ha.

NPC's: save us, save us from the evil.
PC's: Sure.
NPC's: Excellent. That will cost you five hundred gold pieces.
PC's: Huh?
NPC's: To save us. Five hundred gold peices. Hand it over.
PC's: You're kidding.
NPC's: Nope.
PC's: We could be killed.
NPC's: All the more reason to pay in advance.
PC's: You know what - stuff you. We're going to join the bandits and smugglers.

Sure, we had a blast playing the Saltmarsh modules, but there was no way on earth we were playing them as serious adventures unless the DM did a lot of re-writing.
 

Sure

Quasqueton said:
Have you (re)played any of the old-school adventure modules now that you have "matured" as a gamer? Can you enjoy Keep on the Borderlands or Steading of the Hill Giant King now, as much as you did 20 years ago?

Do the old modules have to be played under the old edition rules? Or can they be enjoyable with an update/conversion?

Can you go back? And is it an enjoyable experience?

Quasqueton

Sure you can. It's easy. My group and I are in our mid to late 30's. I started up an old school 1E ADnD Campaign about 8 months ago, we ditched 3E totally. I set the campaign in the Moonshaes using the old Grey Box FR Set and we started with

N1 Against the Cult of the Reptile God. It was set in a marshy part of the islands and it was great fun. The king of Gwynneth was Killed during the first module and I followed that with C4 and C5 To Find a King and The Bane of Llwellyn, and again, it was cool. I meshed the plot with the FR setting as it was originally written and we had a blast. Currently the group is in the North and soon will begin the classic G1-G3 series.
 

I think a lot of the old adventures stand up better now that I'm an adult and understand how the game really works than they did when I was a stupid kid and ran/played them the first time. We had the notion that every module (with a couple obvious exceptions, like The Assassin's Knot)should be played as a straight-up slugfest -- bust down the door, kill whatever you find, gather treasure, go to next room and repeat until there are no more rooms or you have enough xp to go up a level (or maybe if you're so low on hp that you're about to die, but that's a sign of weakness). This endless succession of huge fights led to two things: 1) DM cheating in the players' favor, both by fudging dice-rolls and by playing the monsters "dumb" (e.g. not reacting to the sounds of a huge fight in the next room over); 2) players' obsession with buffing their characters -- obviously if you're going toe to toe with level 4 of the Temple of Elemental Evil, or the Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun, or the Steading of the Hill Giant Chief, you're going to need a lot of hp and a lot of heavy artillery (i.e. magic items), so you eventually end up with a party full of munchkin tanks loaded down with a couple dozen magic items apiece.

I suppose you could say that we weren't really playing "wrong" because we had a lot of fun playing that way for a couple/few years, even if we did eventually get bored with it and move on to other, more 'serious' rpgs -- RuneQuest, Call of Cthulhu, Traveller, etc. -- but what became glaringly obvious when I began to re-read the rulebooks and the modules with 'fresh' eyes and an adult persepctive is that, whether we were having fun or not we were playing the game wrongly, and that the supposed 'problems' that led us away from D&D weren't intrinsic to the game itself but rather to the way we were playing it (although the fact that TSR was also cheesing up the joint with their 2E mess right around that same time certainly helped drive us away...).

It's made abundantly clear time and time again in both the rulebooks and the modules that the way to play the came smartly/successfully (i.e. well) is to be careful and plan ahead, use tactics and trickery to avoid or nullify encounters without direct confrontation (combat) whenever possible, not be distracted from the ultimate goal, and to know when to retreat and regroup when you're low on resources or have encountered something too powerful to handle. Looking at a module like The Steading of the Hill Giant Chief with these considerations in mind it suddenly makes much more sense -- the 'correct' way to succeed at that module isn't to have characters tough enough to take out Nosenra and his entire court all at once, or a DM willing to cheat on their behalf, but rather to sneak around disguised as giant-children and avoid raising the alarm and having to fight all those guys in the first place. The intention is to challenge the skill and ingenuity of the players, not just to test the strength and mettle of their characters. Knowing that, everything that was once old is now new again, and feeling fresher and more intriguing and challenging than ever.
 

Yup, they can work. For our first 3E campaign I ran N1, U2, U3, & I4. It got the PCs up to 7th level quite nicely. Now 2 years later I am following up on plot threads from that first campaign in a new 3.5 game, using the A series as the backbone of the plot. You can't beat infiltrating & ultimately breaking a slaver conspiracy as a plot arch. And waking up basically naked & spell-less in a volcanic dungeon is a challenge any real adventuring group would love to face. ;)
 

Like T.Foster, I think that those modules work better now for me because I have a better idea of what I'm doing.

Over the last few years, I've run The Keep on the Borderlands, The Isle of Dread, Pharoah, Oasis of the White Palm, The Lost Tomb of Martek, Slave Pits of the Undercity, Vecna Lives!, White Plume Mountain, The Veiled Society, Castle Caldwell and Beyond, The Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh, Danger at Dunwater, The Final Enemy and Feast of Goblyns using 3E or 3.5E rules.

Almost all of them were great - even Vecna Lives! - because I'm a much better DM and I'm more able to change the things that don't work. Isle of Dread is a fascinating case: the PCs have been there twice, and retreated twice from the dinosaurs. They're a lot scarier this time around!

I have fond memories of a PC hiding up a tree from the Minotaur in the Caves of Chaos, of a PC turned into a dancing monkey in Oasis, and the PCs getting invited to a slavers dinner (in an extension of A1) and then going...

The one failure would be The Final Enemy, and I well believe that to be a structural problem of the module itself - the series is designed for low level PCs but the first module takes two sessions and the second one session. By the time the PCs reach U3, they need to be 4th level+, but in only 3 sessions from 1st level? Right...

Cheers!
 
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I'm eager to see people's reaction to Dungeon #112, which we just sent to the printer today. A massive 3.5 conversion of WG5: Mordenkainen's Fantastic Adventure fills nearly every page of that issue, a tribute to the 30th anniversary of the Dungeons & Dragons game. We even got the original author, Robert J. Kuntz, to contribute a new "lost" level of the dungeon complex.

I strongly believe that you _can_ go back, and that some of the oldest adventures are still some of the best.

Check us out in a little over a month, and see if you agree.

--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dungeon Magazine
 

Erik Mona said:
Check us out in a little over a month, and see if you agree.

Oh, I will be. I don't have a copy of WG5 (though I've played it... stupid golems), and I'm looking forward to this version.

Cheers!
 

Put me in the "old adventures work better now" camp. I've run updated versions of Castle Amber (my personal favorite), Skarda's Mirror, Cult of the Reptile God, the Assassin's Knot, Tree of Life, Where Chaos Reigns, and Night's Dark Terror. I didn't have any trouble adapting them at all, and for the most part I prefer modules like this to a lot of the ones on the market currently.

Edit: Oh, I also ran updated versions of the 1980s Blackmoor modules (DA 1-3). Now, if only the campaign setting would come out soon! :p
 
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Thanks for this thread! I was considering dusting off my copy of Lost Caverns of Tsocanth, but I wasn't sure how well the 1st edition module would translate into 3.5. Sound like it's not going to be too hard... :)
 

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