Lawful Stupid Rears its Ugly Head... Again

Uhm... since when was looting the bodies considered a Paladin Code offense?

OK... a little background... Rogue searches the body and finds a purse, opens it to see what's inside and puts it in his pocket. All the while the Paladin was standing nearby. Would the Paladin seeing this automatically assume the worst of the Rogue and therefore according to code no longer associate with the Rogue? Or is looting the bodies now considered stepping over the line?

Thanks for any input... (I play the LG Soulknife that is trying to coax the Rogue into using his powers for Awesome!)

--sam

Touching a dead body might violate the Paladin's Code depending upon the culture from which he comes.
I know that in some cultures (such as Feudal Japan's) touching a dead corpse was a horrible and atrocious action. And someone who did so was defiled and needed purification. People who dealt with dead bodies (such as leather workers) did not associate with others not of their class.

I don't think this is Lawful Stupid. I think it's a cultural question.

Lalato said:

Thanks for any input... (I play the LG Soulknife that is trying to coax the Rogue into using his powers for Awesome!)

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So, does he have the power: Smite Lame?

On a serious note, the Paladin might question the Rogue as to why he pocketed the purse, and demand he share the loot w/ all present. If the Rogue agrees, then the Rogue has shown he only suffered a momentary weakness, but his moral fiber prevailed.

it all comes down to whether graverobbing is a crime. If robbing the dead is against the law in your campaign world, or the country they are in, or in the faith the Paladin professes, watching someone loot a dead body would be the same thing as looting the body.

So....is looting the dead illegal or against the Paladin's canonical law? I can't answer that....

In addition to cultural considerations I think it also depends on whose body is being looted. Friend or foe?

Another question: What situation is the campaign world in. Looting the bodies of the fallen is a common practice in times of war, whether they are friend or foe. Too much at stake not to. Stealing personal items may be considered taboo, but useful items (like cash) are open season. All campaigns I've played assume that the humanoid races are 'at war' with the PC's (at least in THEIR mind...).

Without knowing the situation, I'd have to agree with Ike.

It's not graverobbing; that's the criminal act of digging up someone or breaking into their tome after they have received last rites. Graverobbing is MUCH worse; it involves the planned intrusion into someone's place of supposed final rest.

At worst it's stealing from the dead. But it can just as easily be viewed as claiming the belongings of your enemies as a right of conquest - something that is a very accepted historical tradition.

Perhaps stealing a man's wedding ring could be viewed poorly, but I can't see a paladin getting his panties in a bunch over taking the loose change in an enemy's pocket. At most the paladin might just refuse to participate in such activity. At least, if he wants to continue adventuring with that group of PCs.

Okay... here's a couple things to consider. Here are the RAW.

“Good” implies altruism, respect for life, and a concern for the dignity of sentient beings. Good characters make personal sacrifices to help others.

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"Law” implies honor, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability. On the downside, lawfulness can include close-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, judgmentalness, and a lack of adaptability. Those who consciously promote lawfulness say that only lawful behavior creates a society in which people can depend on each other and make the right decisions in full confidence that others will act as they should.

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Lawful Good, “Crusader”: A lawful good character acts as a good person is expected or required to act. She combines a commitment to oppose evil with the discipline to fight relentlessly. She tells the truth, keeps her word, helps those in need, and speaks out against injustice. A lawful good character hates to see the guilty go unpunished.
- Lawful good is the best alignment you can be because it combines honor and compassion.

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Since your playing a Soulknife the paladin code may not nessisarly apply the same here but the only valid point being that you act with honor. but the definitions of Lawful and Good and of a Lawful Good combonation. Looting corpses in and of itself may or may not be offensive. Its a matter of respect and dignity. I would say under most circumstances that looting a corpse would not be offensive. It would however perhaps be bothersome if the fallen foe in question had been an honorable opponent or similar. Depending on the characters outlook on his foes would determine whether looting corpses is acceptable behavior.

What would be good for you perhaps is to establish what criteria makes an foe honorable or deserving of dignified treatment post mortum. I would suggest that 'most opponents' unless they display qualties that incline the character to respect them are undeserving or deserving of only certain dignity. Include perhaps 'outs' for those gray area's or situations motivated by need such as 'if we give them a fueneral rite, its okay cause we are honoring them that way' or 'I honestly <and remember you dont lie> belive he would have wanted this <item of value or power> to based on to someone deserving.' or some similar deluded self serving for the greater good reason like that where a justification is needed in order to ease one's alignment, of course too much of this is likly to shift your alignment as self-intrest over takes tradition and selfless-ness.

that would depend on your history...

If the Palidin has been used to you stealing money from the potential "party fund" and not telling the party then yah! he has every right to be suspicous.
If your a rogue and your looting and putting things away and deliberately not telling the party, then yah he has every right to be suspicous.
He would/should confront you and ask what you found, if you havent already volunteered the info.

Basically imagine a friend/acquantence of yours suspected of being a thief acting suspicous and hiding stuff wouldnt you think twice about the guy?

ThornCrest

Lalato said:

Uhm... since when was looting the bodies considered a Paladin Code offense?

OK... a little background... Rogue searches the body and finds a purse, opens it to see what's inside and puts it in his pocket. All the while the Paladin was standing nearby. Would the Paladin seeing this automatically assume the worst of the Rogue and therefore according to code no longer associate with the Rogue? Or is looting the bodies now considered stepping over the line?

Thanks for any input... (I play the LG Soulknife that is trying to coax the Rogue into using his powers for Awesome!)

--sam

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Also, consider this. Lawful Good doesn't mean Lawful Perfect. Too many look at the role and say "Well, if you're Lawful Good, that means every infraction, every wrong you ever see, should make you mad and you should flip out and correct it."

That's only true to a very small degree. Perhaps your character has misgivings about looting fallen enemies... but face it. Even our most prominent, "Lawful Good" figures have gone through life with a "comprimising" atittude at times, especially if they're in the middle of an alleyway following a life-or-death situation.

The other suggestions apply as well, like preventing the rogue from not helping the party use the taken resources to help their quest. But really... you'd have to consider just how far your Lawful Good character would get in the world if he were "Lawful Perfect". After a while, even the good members of your party would begin to resent him, and then he might as well become a loner.