Denied DEX = Flat-Footed?

[Hrothgar Rannúlfr]

Is there any difference between being denied a Dexterity bonus and being flat-footed?

Example: Suppose a character successfully feints against an opponent... According to the SRD, "the next melee attack" he makes "against the target does not allow" the target "to use his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any)."

Is the target, now, considered flat-footed? If not, what is the difference between being flat-footed and being denied Dexterity bonus to AC?

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

The difference is that Uncanny Dodge protects you from being flatfooted, but not from the more general condition of losing dex to AC. Sort of like how square is a subset of rectangle, a smaller, more specific grouping. Both allow a Rogue to sneak attack, but losing dex is slightly more valuable than simply making the foe flatfooted, in the rare case that he has Uncanny Dodge or possibly a similar monster ability.

 

[Shin Okada]

The short answer is NO.

A flat-footed character is denied one's dexterity bonus to AC. But being denied one's dexterity to AC does not automatically mean he is flat-footed.

In addition to being denied one's dexterity bonus to AC, a flat-footed creature can't make attack of opportunities.

Also, there may be some special attacks, abilities, rules and such which are applied only to flat-footed creatures.

 

[Hrothgar Rannúlfr]

Thank you, both. This helps, a lot!

 

[NewJeffCT]

I believe you lose your DEX bonus when being grappled, but are not considered flat-footed.

 

[aboyd]

Yeah, what NewJeffCT said. If you happened to be a wizard with the Abrupt Jaunt ability, you would not be able to teleport out of danger when flat-footed, but you certainly would be able to teleport out of danger when losing dexterity due to a grapple.

So it makes a difference.

 

[Hrothgar Rannúlfr]

Thanks.

Which sourcebook has Abrupt Jaunt? I'm not familiar with that one, and it sounds like a nice ability.

 

[Shin Okada]

Which sourcebook has Abrupt Jaunt?

PHB 2. One of Immediate Magic alternative class feature for specialized wizard (Conjurer, in this case).

 

[freebiewitz]

Lets say you have a DEX of 18, now lets say you wear nothing. Your AC would be 14 altogether.
Now lets say you have the mobility feat which gives you 4 AC vs AoO.

So for all intents and purposes we'll just say you have 18 AC.
Now if you were denied your dex your would be on 14 AC.
If you were caught flatfooted you would be on 10 AC because mobility is a dodging type of AC thing, not sure how to explain.

I think thats the case anyways, correct me if I'm wrong ok?

 

[Shin Okada]

Lets say you have a DEX of 18, now lets say you wear nothing. Your AC would be 14 altogether.
Now lets say you have the mobility feat which gives you 4 AC vs AoO.

So for all intents and purposes we'll just say you have 18 AC.

Only against AoO. Mobility feat is effective only against AoO.

Your AC is 14 against usual attacks and 18 against AoO.

Now if you were denied your dex your would be on 14 AC.

Dodge bonus is not applied whenever a creature is denied its Dexterity bonus to AC.

So, if you were denied your dex bonus to AC, your Dodge bonus to AC is also denied. So, your AC is 10 against both usual attacks and AoO.

If you were caught flatfooted you would be on 10 AC because mobility is a dodging type of AC thing, not sure how to explain.

Flat-footed condition denies your Dex bonus to AC. Thus also denies your Dodge bonus. Again, your AC is 10 against both usual attacks and AoO.

Edit: And in this case, if you happen to have Uncanny Dodge class feature, you do not lose your Dex bonus to AC while flat-footed. Thus, your Dodge bonus to AC is not denied. Thus Your AC is 14 against usual attacks and 18 against AoO.