Repulsive Armor vs Warding Blades

[DarkLord Of DForce]

Okay, you've got Repulsive Armor up, and the turn before, your Avenger had used Warding Blade.

So then a monster enters an adjacent square, do you get the OA from Warding Blade before the monster is pushed back one square, or ?

Repulsive Armor is an immediate reaction, while Warding Blades description says its an Opportunity Action, so I assume thats an immediate interrupt.

I took it that if a monster entered an adj. square, that Warding Blades OA would immediately hit it, then Repulsive Armor would shove it back.

But I just wanted to check and verify.

Thanks all!

 

[DracoSuave]

Okay, you've got Repulsive Armor up, and the turn before, your Avenger had used Warding Blade.

So then a monster enters an adjacent square, do you get the OA from Warding Blade before the monster is pushed back one square, or ?

Repulsive Armor is an immediate reaction, while Warding Blades description says its an Opportunity Action, so I assume thats an immediate interrupt.

I took it that if a monster entered an adj. square, that Warding Blades OA would immediately hit it, then Repulsive Armor would shove it back.

But I just wanted to check and verify.

Thanks all!

The order is this:

Warding Blades kicks in, and interrupts the monster's movement.
Then, if the movement can still occur, it does.
Then Repulsive Armor kicks in.

Opportunity actions are NOT Immediate Interrupts, they are simply interrupts. Calling them Immediate would mean that the repulsive armor couldn't be used at all, because of the limit of one immediate action per round.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

The order is this:

Warding Blades kicks in, and interrupts the monster's movement.
Then, if the movement can still occur, it does.
Then Repulsive Armor kicks in.

Opportunity actions are NOT Immediate Interrupts, they are simply interrupts. Calling them Immediate would mean that the repulsive armor couldn't be used at all, because of the limit of one immediate action per round.

OA's aren't interrupts AT ALL.

RAW does not address the order in which triggered events happen. When the enemy moves adjacent 2 things trigger. What order you resolve them in is up to the DM. If one was an interrupt then it would go first, but if they are both reactions or if one is an OA and the other a reaction then its simply undefined.

 

[abyssaldeath]

OA's aren't interrupts AT ALL.

The PHB would beg to differ.

Interrupts Action: An opportunity action interrupts
the action that triggered it.

Interrupts Target’s Action: An opportunity action
takes place before the target finishes its action.
After the opportunity attack, the creature resumes
its action. If the target is reduced to 0 hit points or
fewer by the opportunity attack, it can’t finish its
action because it’s dead or dying.

 

[Prestidigitalis]

The PHB would beg to differ.

In 4e, some actions are "Immediate Interrupts" and some creatures are "Dire Wolves", but there is no "Interrupt" action and no creature called a "Dire".

An OA "interrupts" the action only in an English language sense.

I agree that the rules do not say whether OAs or Immediate Interrupts come first. Its up to the DM until WotC clarifies the issue.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

The PHB would beg to differ.

Read ALL of page 268, at least the first half of the page. There are two types of "Triggered Actions", Opportunity Actions, and Immediate Actions. Interrupts are immediate actions, thus Opportunity Actions, including Opportunity Attacks, are NOT interrupts.

The terminology is a bit obtuse in the sense that Opportunity Actions, Immediate Interrupts, and Immediate Reactions can all interrupt another action, but the distinction is reasonably important in terms of other rules sections.

 

[abyssaldeath]

An Opportunity Action is an interrupt, but it is not an Immediate Interrupt. The interrupt portion of the name of the action Immediate Interrupt is just a name. It is the rules of the actions that matter and in those rules on how those two actions interact with their triggers is exactly the same. Both actions will occur before the triggered action is resolved. So yes, Opportunity Actions are interrupts.

 

[Prestidigitalis]

An Opportunity Action is an interrupt, but it is not an Immediate Interrupt. The interrupt portion of the name of the action Immediate Interrupt is just a name. It is the rules of the actions that matter and in those rules on how those two actions interact with their triggers is exactly the same. Both actions will occur before the triggered action is resolved. So yes, Opportunity Actions are interrupts.

No offense intended -- I respect your opinion -- but I think the language of the second and last sentences is dangerous -- it leads to the kind of thinking you are responding to.

In 4e there is no such thing as "an interrupt". There just isn't. There are "Immediate Interrupts" but not "[I/i]nterrupts".

I'm fine with it if someone wants to refer to an Immediate Interrupt as "an interrupt" during gameplay or in a novel or haiku, but in a rules discussion about what type of action something is, the strict pedantry is necessary.

Sorry if this seems excessive. Normally I'm pretty relaxed about most things, but this one is worth a bit of argument because it leads to so much confusion.

 

[DarkLord Of DForce]

First of all, thanks to everyone for replying, much appreciated.

Now, note taken and correction accepted on the difference in 4e between an interrupt and an immediate interrupt.

After reading the posts here, and re-reading the PH, pages 268, 290-293, I'm convinced that even though my terminology use was wrong, that my conclusion was right.

Warding Blade would give the OA, then Repulsive Armor would kick them back 1 square. (because one is an immediate interrupt and the other is an immediate reaction).

Now to present it to the DM.

Thanks all!

 

[DracoSuave]

I'm fine with it if someone wants to refer to an Immediate Interrupt as "an interrupt" during gameplay or in a novel or haiku, but in a rules discussion about what type of action something is, the strict pedantry is necessary.

When the rules entry for the thing in question tells you verbatim that it interrupts something, then calling it an interrupt is a -very- reasonable thing to do. It interrupts, it is an interrupt.

It isn't an -immediate- action, and I think nitpickery over the 'interrupt' part WHEN THE RULES FOR IT SAY 'INTERRUPT' is a waste of time and effort. The -important- word, ruleswise, is immediate vs. opportunity and that is what you should be focused on.