Time for the Character Builder to be free?

[wlmartin]

Actually, I think the character builder should be free. It's designed to get players into the game, right? Make it free. However, it only makes you a character sheet. No power cards. No explanations of each feat. It just does the math for your feats, class features, and what you have equipped and that is it. Why?

That gets people to buy books to find out what their stuff does.

The Character Builder is killing the retail book sales, to a point. It DID kill the power cards line (which I actually liked, and wish was still around. Rules Compendium + Power card of favored class = New player for $30). Most people I know like to bring characters with all sorts of stuff they have no idea what it does or where it is from because they made them on the Character Builder. Get that junk off the sheets and get those people to buy books and fraking read something!

Another reason for this, how much of the "Pathfinder is outselling D&D' is because the metrics don't take into account the DDI sales in place of the fraking books? Sorry, Pathfinder is the best (non d20 Modern IMHO) iteration of the v3.5 rule set, but there is no way it is outselling D&D in total. Game Books maybe, but all related merchandise, novels, and digital offerings? Not a chance.

And that is because Wizards is killing their book sales with a Character Builder that makes the books pointless. Make the character builder just MAKE A SHEET, make it free, and watch the book sales go back up as people buy the books to play the game, like in the old days.

Firstly... (and you won't see me telling you how to do it since downloading it without a DDI subscription is unlicensed) , you can download the Character Builder in an offline version yourself. It enables you to do everything the Character Builder does except it is no longer updated

Secondly... There is an excel spreadsheet program that you can use to generate a Character Sheet. It is quite efficient and works well with Macros and Functions to lay your Character Sheet (with Feat and Power choices) quite well but it does lack the ability to show or print Power Cards. Unlike the Offline CB, this is something free to use and just google it online to find it.

Thirdly... I strongly disagree that offering the CB for free would encourage people to buy more books. Most people that use DDI do it for the CB (not the only reason but a big one) and chances are they pulled the offline CB (not updated since Nov last year!!) because people were no longer using DDI for it.

WotC is a business and I would imagine they make a LOT of money from charging people to use DDI. A lot of people like it for the RC, a lot for the articles, features and magazines but I would imagine the most time people spend on it is using the CB...

DDI and the money it makes WotC is the only reason I am not concerned that book sales are down. As long as they reap in the cash there it will support their efforts to develop the game... I believe that if DDI was gone and they were relying on simple book sales in the current economy, D&D wouldn't die out but the content released would be subpar and the dates between releases would get longer and longer.

 

[Dannager]

How about explain in detail just what you mean by this statement? You seem to imply that anyone who plays a previous edition, or Pathfinder play for nostalgia sake. Prove me wrong here.

No. That's not what I meant, and you're going to take me at my word for it because, frankly, you don't have another choice. I'm not going to bait you, ForeverSlayer. It's like inviting a bull into a china shop.

 

[Dannager]

Or maybe the other side is reveling in the the imagined domination of D&D

See, if people were actually doing this you might have a point.

 

[Dannager]

LOL!!!! You you somehow have proof of this?

None that you'll accept.

I hate to break it to you but lots of people that play Pathfinder could give a rats ass about D&D.

You're right. Some don't care. Some do care. And some pretend not to care, but totally do anyway.

It's not like they don't have access to D&D, they choose what they want to play and they prefer Pathfinder over D&D.

Absolutely. I prefer to sit down when I take a leak rather than use a urinal. That doesn't mean I don't occasionally wonder if this preference is a threat to my manhood.

Sounds to me like you are trying to defend D&D from Pathfinder.

No, just offering an explanation for a certain sort of behavior. You can think what you like, though.

You are coming up with assumptions about Pathfinder's player base that is simply not true.

You're totally free to believe that.

Of course, you'd be wrong.

I'm not talking about the Pathfinder player base.

I'm talking about the sort of person who comes online, sees something indicating that Pathfinder is beating D&D in a narrow slice of the market for a few months, and throws a party celebrating the downfall of D&D.

I'm not sure how you extrapolated that to the entire Pathfinder player base, but it strikes me as telling that you clearly think that when someone mentions people celebrating the demise of D&D, you immediately think of the entire Pathfinder player base. Either you believe that's how the entire Pathfinder player base acts, or you believe that everyone else believes that's how the entire Pathfinder player base acts. Either way, it's not a good impression to have.

Looks to me like you are the one who is insecure with 4th edition D&D.

You're also free to believe this.

Now stop being so contrary. This thread is about the Character Builder, not about your anti-4e crusade.

 

[wlmartin]

And the award for hijacking a post to winge and moan about how much he hates 4e goes to... ForeverSlayer.

Pathfinder is a joke however it did exactly what you and many other pre-4e players want and created a place for you to flex your 3e / 3.5e muscles and for that I am grateful as it means less 4e haters moaning in this and other forums about the "good ol days"

I personally don't like Pathfinder but just like Warhammer, WoW and other games I am not into, I understand many other people love them and I am happy for them... I love D&D, I love 4e... thats what I love.

Anyways - - - back to point.

ForeverSlayer... I havent seen a post of yours for quite a while complaining about 4e.. I am unsure if that is because your predictions about the non-existent 5e never came about in the latest conventions or that you have been spending your time Pathfinding as not to bother us with your thoughts but it was a very nice break not having to defend my beloved 4e at every corner.

Please get the point. Anti 4e sentiments are not wanted here... I would pick an emoticon smiley to show you how I (and many others here no doubt) feel but there isnt one that has disdain, dissapointment, rolling of eyes and huffing-puffing all in one, so I will try



Grow up... please, its no longer getting old, its past that - its getting redundant

 

[Dannager]

Pathfinder is a joke

Opinions aside, this isn't the place to be insulting games you don't play.

 

[wlmartin]

Opinions aside, this isn't the place to be insulting games you don't play.

To be fair, I didnt just say "Pathfinder is a joke"
I did say that it is a joke, followed by the acceptance that it is something many people enjoy and I whole heartedly support that

I don't think insulting a game system is ever the issue with discussions like this, it is more the complete conversionism that comes along with those who believe a certain edition or games system.

I don't like Pathfinder, I don't have an opinion on those that play it and hope they enjoy themselves but me not liking it and thinking it is a joke is a far cry from me telling people that if they like Pathfinder they are wrong, every other system is better... I am not saying that and nor would I ever....

There are lots of things in this world that are beyond rubbish and I feel comfortable expressing my opinion about those things here and anywhere else but I often feel such opinions can become twisted or misquoted so I often include a stronger context of my view explaining that just because I think Pathfinder is pants, doesn't mean I am attacking those that play it...

If I am insulting towards Pathfinder then so be it, but better I express those opinions here in a context that supports my point regarding anti-4e posts than to visit a Pathfinder forum, complain about how rubbish the game is and demand people agree with me.

I do think there is a difference in these things... even if others dont

 

[gyor]

The character creator and compendium should have a complete version with ADS for free and a version for pay with out ads. That would also end the piracy and make money off those who are curious but don't want to commit.

You could even have the ads that come up connected to your choices. Choose druid and an ad pops up for a Nissan Leaf, choose Wizard and an ad for the latest Harry Potter movie on DVD, pick Sune as your Goddess and a perfume from chanel pops up, pick Sharess instead and an ad from Hustler instead pops up, pick a shifter and an ad for leg wax pops up

other areas could have random ads. And maybe to download the free version you have to do a consumer survey with the odd survey popping up now and again.

The most profitable newspapers are free online, because there is no money in a strict paywall compared to ads. Some try to mix the two.

You Tube, aside from a small mature section, payed for by ads, not a pay wall. Countless others as well.

Even most none movie or porn channels on tv, make most of there money on ads.

I believe that the thinking in media now is that what you sell isn't the content. Its the user of content that is the product. Your what's being sold in other words, or at least influence with you.

 

[gyor]

The character creator and compendium should have a complete version with ADS for free and a version for pay with out ads. That would also end the piracy and make money off those who are curious but don't want to commit.

You could even have the ads that come up connected to your choices. Choose druid and an ad pops up for a Nissan Leaf, choose Wizard and an ad for the latest Harry Potter movie on DVD, pick Sune as your Goddess and a perfume from chanel pops up, pick Sharess instead and an ad from Hustler instead pops up, pick a shifter and an ad for leg wax pops up

other areas could have random ads. And maybe to download the free version you have to do a consumer survey with the odd survey popping up now and again.

The most profitable newspapers are free online, because there is no money in a strict paywall compared to ads. Some try to mix the two.

You Tube, aside from a small mature section, payed for by ads, not a pay wall. Countless others as well.

Even most none movie or porn channels on tv, make most of there money on ads.

I believe that the thinking in media now is that what you sell isn't the content. Its the user of content that is the product. Your what's being sold in other words, or at least influence with you.

 

[wlmartin]

The character creator and compendium should have a complete version with ADS for free and a version for pay with out ads. That would also end the piracy and make money off those who are curious but don't want to commit.

You could even have the ads that come up connected to your choices. Choose druid and an ad pops up for a Nissan Leaf, choose Wizard and an ad for the latest Harry Potter movie on DVD, pick Sune as your Goddess and a perfume from chanel pops up, pick Sharess instead and an ad from Hustler instead pops up, pick a shifter and an ad for leg wax pops up

other areas could have random ads. And maybe to download the free version you have to do a consumer survey with the odd survey popping up now and again.

The most profitable newspapers are free online, because there is no money in a strict paywall compared to ads. Some try to mix the two.

You Tube, aside from a small mature section, payed for by ads, not a pay wall. Countless others as well.

Even most none movie or porn channels on tv, make most of there money on ads.

I believe that the thinking in media now is that what you sell isn't the content. Its the user of content that is the product. Your what's being sold in other words, or at least influence with you.

I am not sure Advertising within D&D works as well as other mediums.

I can't think of anything that WotC could advertise to their player base?
Cheetos? Mountain Dew? Pizza Hut?

I personally would prefer to pay for DDI (which I dont use at present) that have Adverts for it... which is strange because I have a massivly conflicting view on TV license where the opposite should be true

(In the UK if you own a TV you need to pay for a license which is around £130 a year... this is paid to the BBC who use it to fund their programs and channel content on the basis that they don't have adverts in their programs. I think a great proportion of people who have to pay for a TV License would prefer to have adverts instead of being forced to pay £130 a year but that aside it is the biggest FRACKIN scam in the world.... you have to pay £130 a year just to own a TV even if you swore on a stack of bibles to never tune into a BBC channel or could even prove you didn't have the ability to receive the channels)

That aside, advertising is not really the answer for WotC... I don't think they would make nearly as much money in advertising dues as they would in charging people to use their DDI service and besides, if they ever want to develop their online publishing arm (which they REALLY do) then they need to find ways to encourage MORE people to visit DDI and pay subscription, not find ways to help them weasel out of it.

Mark my words

In 5-10 years time, D&D will no longer be available in Paper format, it will be all online and we will all be walking around with iPad / tablet style displays instead of books ... and we wont care because in the future the books wont cost us anything, we simply pay a monthly fee to have the license to read them... ideally by then they will have found new ways to apply DRM to the content and all will be fine.

However none of that will happen if their subscription drops to 0 because everyone is using the LITE version of Character Builder that whilst generating lots of money for WotC, is not encouraging people to subscribe to their content.


DDI was once about cool interesting tools that helped people play the game better but is now about encouraging more and more people to subscribe to content that they have control over and is inaccessible elsewhere. Once they have you hooked on that (be it Dragon Magazine, their articles or the CB or RC) then you will be a lot more accepting to paying an extra $5 a month to get an encrypted copy of the rulebooks on a secure DRM basis

Do I think WotC want to take over the world?
Nope - but I do think they have stronger goals than to simply make a few dollars with DDI, the future for D&D is online content and that is where WotC are leading us... and they arent going to get anywhere with 0 subscribers