Doctor Who Series 6 Fall run

[Herschel]

Ummm, WTF?!?!?!?!?! That was ...... bizarre, to say the least. I can't decide if it was brilliant or I absolutely detested it (Let's Kill Hitler). There's obviously much more coming even though it looks like Moffat has seemingly painted himself in a corner again.

 

[Remus Lupin]

Oh, I thought it was a great episode. One of the top two or three so far of the season. Lots of good lines, decent plot development, some answers about River, and some tantalizing threads to follow for future episodes.

As I explained to my wife, when she asked what the First Question was, that no one knows it, but of course we all know the answer!

 

[Herschel]

Yeah, I'm just not sure I like the River backstory as they've done it. She's probably my favorite character and I'm feeling a bit underwhelmed with her part in the episode. It also can't wrap up that cleanly and quickly.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Yeah, I'm just not sure I like the River backstory as they've done it. She's probably my favorite character and I'm feeling a bit underwhelmed with her part in the episode. It also can't wrap up that cleanly and quickly.

I am a little unhappy. River and Jack are my two fav things to come out of the new run, and they seam to have no idea how to handle her.

Regening into her, as is was a bit of a cop out, them leaving her is worse. I have been hopeing for a 'young' river as a compainian for atleast a little while.

And a poision that no one ever cured, that stops regeneration, and is topical... and no one EVER weaponized it??? Shoot super soakers full of it at time lords for gods sake.

and the riveal of River growing up with amy and rory seamed forced, and even more hoaky then normal who.

all in all it seamed like some of it was way too quick. 1st eap back and no reason to look for the baby...um except we know that there is no way AMY would let them keep and raise her...even though she turns out to be river.

and can someone please explain to me why oh ehy anyone smart enough to make a time traveling miniturizzeing robot is dumb enough to think they can kill hitler???

WORSE... pre ww2 the Doctor told hitler the british are comeing...did he just start the war?

and did mel/river have no parents? did amy and rory go to school with a homeless familyless girl? OR are there big gaping plot wholes you can drive a mack turck through??


I really liked the idea of Dr River Song, the Doctor's long time compainon and lover, maybe wife, being the daughter of two compainions... but it totaly doesn't work if she is never there. I had imagined this season ending with amy and rorey getting the baby back, rasieng her, then when the Dr comes to visit she becomes a new compainon and works on her doctorit inbetween adventures...

remeber the Doctor was at every one of her birthdays... um well...maybe only in this form.

And the "i want to kill you" to "I want to save you" was soo quick I think I got whip lash just watching it.

 

[MarkB]

I liked it a lot, but felt that it completely wasted its setting in its focus on the main characters.

I did think the Starship Humanoid with miniaturised crew was a neat idea.

and can someone please explain to me why oh ehy anyone smart enough to make a time traveling miniturizzeing robot is dumb enough to think they can kill hitler???

Well, first, the Justice Wossnames didn't kill their intended victims they - as stated - caught up to them near the end of their timelines and "put them through hell", which seemed to consist of some form of agony beam.

And second, just before the TARDIS entered stage left, the crew of the Tesselactor had just realised that they were too early in Hitler's timeline, and were about to abort.

 

[Mallus]

I am incapable of not loving any work of fiction with lines like these:

"You've got a time machine, I've got a gun. What the Hell? Let's kill Hitler."

And...

"At least I'm not a time-travelling, shape-shifting robot operated by miniaturized cross people, which I have got to admit, I didn't see coming. "

And...

"Okay. I'm trapped inside a giant robot replica of my wife. I'm really trying not to see this as a metaphor."

The episode was exuberant, sentimental, a dash dark (and not because it was set in Nazi Germany), and more than a little meta. Custom-suited for my purposes.

 

[Herschel]

Don't get me wrong, there was a lot of great lines in it and the Hitler red herring was fine but Mels is Melody will be River all wrapped up that quickly and cleanly? That doesn't give the character or story the treatment it deserves. I mean the instantanious change from I'm sent to kill you to I'm going to save you by giving up so much is just a bit too far-fetched for my tastes.

 

[Mallus]

Don't get me wrong, there was a lot of great lines in it and the Hitler red herring was fine but Mels is Melody will be River all wrapped up that quickly and cleanly? That doesn't give the character or story the treatment it deserves.

I thought it was enough, close to perfect.

There was a wonderful metaphor going on in the episode, which might have been obscured by Hitler in the cupboard, the robot full of miniaturized cross people, and the poisoned Fred Astaire routine: Amy and Rory are looking for their daughter. It turns out she was an important part of their lives from the very beginning, they just didn't realize it, it wasn't the way expected, and they come into this knowledge after it's too late to change any of it. They're stuck with the lives they've led, despite knowing a bloke with a time machine.

Except for knowing the bloke w/the time machine part, this is pretty much true of everyone's life. It's not what we expect, it's all we have, and, if we're lucky, we can look back with our memories and find the good and meaningful things we didn't know the significance of at the time.

I didn't need (any more of) the machinations of plot. We know how River dies, how she was born, that she was kinda-sorta raised by, or at least alongside of, her parents, we now know we've been watching the story not only two people falling in love, but how they redeemed each other. Anything more would be going through the motions.

There's also something lovely about the title; it's not just an attention-grabber and a red herring, it dovetails straight into the overarching theme. On the surface, it's the line that every SF fan has always wanted to hear in their favorite show or story (which had time travel). And, I'm sure, it's a line every Who writer has always wished they had the freedom to write. It speaks to the power of the whole genre: we can do anything, set any wrong to right, look at the endless redemptive power at our disposal!

Except what can you never do in a time travel story? Kill Hitler. Or your grandparents. You should even be careful around butterflies in the Pleistocene. There are things we cannot undo without losing ourselves.

Maybe it's just me, but I love the way Mels could say, "Let's kill Hitler", the way it could be given voice, but, in the end, not done, because even with fantasy, with a time machine, there's a hard limit to what can be taken back. Sometimes redemption is reconciliation, it is letting go, making peace, falling in love with your assassin, giving your life for your victim, and realizing the only childhood you'll share with your daughter is the one you had...

I'll stop now !

...is just a bit too far-fetched for my tastes.

I'll say this: Moffat combines sentimentality and gamesmanship into something I find irresistible. I want to believe!

 

[Herschel]

That's just it. I've been able to roll with his stuff up to that point but it was broken right then and there for me.

Plus, it would have been nice to be able to later introduce a younger River just to keep the thread going off and on for years.

 

[Pinotage]

My head hurts. I'm finding this all very confusing, but then at least that's the style of Doctor Who these days. Only by the final episode do you really figure out what's going on.

Can somebody explain something to me, though? The whole River/Doctor premise is that he meets her for the first time when she's going to die, and she meets him for the first time when he's much older. So does this episode count as the first actual meeting between River and the Doctor. Or are they referring to a different 'version' of River, i.e. a good River?

Pinotage