D&D 5E Light release schedule: More harm than good?

[Hussar]

That presumes that the AP's come with no new mechanics (certainly not true so far - the new AP comes with a what 40 page free pdf of new mechanics?) and no new magic items or anything new mechanical. That's a bit hard to believe and isn't really true historically. Note, Monster Manuals can certainly add to bloat. For example, how a Monster Manual interacts with Polymorph and Shape Changing.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

That presumes that the AP's come with no new mechanics (certainly not true so far - the new AP comes with a what 40 page free pdf of new mechanics?) and no new magic items or anything new mechanical. That's a bit hard to believe and isn't really true historically. Note, Monster Manuals can certainly add to bloat. For example, how a Monster Manual interacts with Polymorph and Shape Changing.

You've now stretched the definition of "bloat" so far that is has become synonymous with "rules." That's preposterous. One could imagine, for example, a whole book with nothing but new rules about ships, navigation, sea hazards and underwater magic and it would add nothing to the Dreaded Bloat of Horror.

 

[bmfrosty]

You've now stretched the definition of "bloat" so far that is has become synonymous with "rules." That's preposterous. One could imagine, for example, a whole book with nothing but new rules about ships, navigation, sea hazards and underwater magic and it would add nothing to the Dreaded Bloat of Horror.

It would be pretty easy to define anything past the basic high fantasy setting to be bloat. Hell, anything past Forgotten Realms as bloat. I'm not arguing that.

I would argue that setting up sub brands for some of the other settings down the road with their own PHB, MM, and DMG would be an interesting way to go.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

It would be pretty easy to define anything past the basic high fantasy setting to be bloat. Hell, anything past Forgotten Realms as bloat. I'm not arguing that.

I am arguing that. How easy would that be, really? Please try it. How could additional fantasy settings be defined as "bloat"?

 

[Sailor Moon]

I think "bloat" is being entirely over used here.

 

[Iosue]

Anything that serves a minority of the audience rather than the majority is bloat. You can't defeat bloat, you can only hope to contain it.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

Anything that serves a minority of the audience rather than the majority is bloat.

You mean... like Gnomes?

 

[delericho]

Maybe they should split some of the other settings into differently brandings. It's still D&D, but here it's D&D Eberron. Here it's D&D Planescape. Here it's D&D Dragonlance.

The problem with that plan is that then you're competing against yourself - the majority of gamers actually use no setting at all, and very very few use more than one. So if you're putting out books for Eberron and for Planescape and for Dragonlance, you're doing three times the work creating those books, and all for fewer sales (in total) than you're likely to get from one "Complete Martial Warrior Handbook Power" or whatever.

Plus, the history of D&D advocates strongly against it - supporting several settings was one of the factors (although not the only one, nor probably the largest) that killed TSR. That being the case, WotC are rather unlikely to repeat it.

 

[Nellisir]

That presumes that the AP's come with no new mechanics (certainly not true so far - the new AP comes with a what 40 page free pdf of new mechanics?) and no new magic items or anything new mechanical. That's a bit hard to believe and isn't really true historically. Note, Monster Manuals can certainly add to bloat. For example, how a Monster Manual interacts with Polymorph and Shape Changing.

So what you're saying is that in my example, the single largest category contributing to bloat is the adventure paths. Cool. So lets get rid of those.



The thing is, as Mirrorball Man points out below, you've set it up so "bloat" = "rules". And errata. Any rules. So what it really looks like is that bloat is inevitable, but "bloat" within the context of an adventure is OK. We've got a fundamental conflict going on in that case, because that's the kind of bloat I find the least useful and most egregious, since it's specific rather than general, and prompted by circumstances of the adventure rather than a larger theme or conceit.

Ultimately, we'll just have to see how things play out.

 

[Dire Bare]

The thing is, as Mirrorball Man points out below, you've set it up so "bloat" = "rules". And errata. Any rules.

While you certainly could define anything past the three core rulebooks "bloat", that isn't really what WotC and a significant portion of their fanbase is worried about.

Additional adventures and additional monsters aren't really the bloat WotC is worried about. More monsters are just more options for the DM to craft adventures with . . . . I've never met a DM who's complained about "too many monster books". Although, towards the end of 3E it did seem that some of the critters in the last few monster books were, well, filler. Specific rules modules aren't serious bloat either, as they are very situational and don't add a ton of weight to the core rules.

Campaign settings aren't exactly bloat, but each individual setting (beyond the Realms) isn't desired by enough folks to make printing books (even e-printing) worthwhile. Greyhawk is awesome, but are there enough folks who would buy the new 5E campaign book to make it worth doing? Probably not.

It's character options that are the serious bloat issue. Character classes, subclasses, feats, weird weapons, backgrounds, spells, and magic items. When you *need* seven books to create the character you want, or have to wade through hundreds of options in an online character generator, that's the bloat problem. It's a bit of a perception issue rather than a reality issue, as you never truly need to purchase all of those options, but perception is reality . . . . if players feel like they need to purchase multiple splats to "keep up", their interest can diminish. Not to mention each splat sells less copy than the one previous.

I also think there is a "core book" bloat issue. The perception that to have a complete D&D collection includes not just the core three, but a Deities & Demigods, Manual of the Planes, Draconomicon, etc, etc . . . that can really be a dash of cold water to somebody interested in the game.

I think we'll get a lot of those products (or, at least, I hope we will), but on a much slower pace with higher quality control and an effort to minimize that perception of "bloat".