D&D 5E Finding 5th edition too "safe".

[MechaPilot]

Was this meant in a humorous way? Because the OP wasn't asking how to make 5e more like 2e in every way (progression, balance, etc.), he was just asking how to make 5e more lethal, like older editions.

No, it was not meant to be humorous. ASI's contribute to the PCs being able to get through challenges more easily by bumping their bonuses. If you want to make the game more lethal, removing a source of +1s to AC determining stats and HP determining stats and to hit and damage determining stats and save DC determining stats certainly sounds like it would be effective in escalating the lethality (at least to me).

Also, I realize the OP wasn't trying to make 5e run like 2e in every way possible. If I had thought that was the OP's intent, I would have also suggested the following:

Have all caster spells scale by caster level instead of slot level
Multiply the XP requirements for levelling by 1.5 or 2 for caster classes
Allow as the only fighter subclass the champion
etc

 

[Tony Vargas]

You're not seriously arguing that anybody wasted time with item saves.

I routinely used them, when the PC carrying the item failed his save. Magic items had a pretty good chance of saving, though. You'd lose potions vs crushing blow and scrolls vs fire, but most permanent item were of sterner stuff, and the ones that gave you bonuses got those bonuses, so protective items, in particular, tended to stick around.

But then, I also used weapon v armor type.

+1 to this idea. My current campaign (four weeks old now? Six?) requires 10x XP to level up (so 2nd level is 3000 XP), with 50% reduced XP from monsters if you don't kill or permanently dispose of them, and additionally reduced XP if the monster's CR is lower than your level.

I think they may have had a basically good idea behind going for the classic feel (randomly deadly at low level, challenging through a mid-level 'sweet' spot, 'too easy' thereafter), but adjusting exp so you speed through the problematic early and late levels, and linger in the more playable sweet spot.
I also did something like the half-exp for just bypassing or temporarily defeating a monster, but I kept track and kept halving it. So if you evaded the same monster 3 times you'd get just 1/16th exp for doing it again (or a whole 1/8th for finally putting it out of it's misery). I guess that encourages 'murder hoboism.'

On the other hand, you do get XP for spending gold offscreen on character goals (like wooing a love interest or saving your home village) on a 1:1 basis--basically you can convert gold to XP. So, if anyone ever earns the 3,550,000 XP necessary to get to twentieth level it will almost certainly be from spending treasure and not from killing monsters.

If I were still running 1e with the expectation of exp-for-gold, I would totally snag that.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Bacon Bits]

Y'all are ing nuts.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Xvartslayer]

Y'all are ing nuts.

After a tough fight with a black dragon, I remember our cleric standing nude in the chamber holding a crowbar and a quill writing pen, the only items he owned after a very bad run of item saving throws (aside from a nat 20 on his writing feather, of course.)

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

I also used item saves back in the day.

Not all the time, nor even most of the time, but I did use them - my decision which rules to use and which not was a campaign-to-campaign thing, tuning the rules to better fit the feel I wanted for a particular campaign.

Had a group that would like to play a "hardcore" campaign every third campaign or so where we would strictly adhere to the core rules, and only add in optional rules if they resulted in something else the players and their characters had to worry about (such as item saves, and weapon type v. armor), leaving out the majority of optional rules designed to make the game easier on the players (like the increased level limit for high prime requisite rule, or the optional classes).

 

[Sacrosanct]

After a tough fight with a black dragon, I remember our cleric standing nude in the chamber holding a crowbar and a quill writing pen, the only items he owned after a very bad run of item saving throws (aside from a nat 20 on his writing feather, of course.)

Item saving throws (especially for black dragons) are real. Just ask Riverwind.

 

[the Jester]

I'm reminded that demi-humans had great save bonuses in 2e.

As I stated previously, Saving throws in AD&D and 2e served a different purpose. They were a mercy roll. You rolled them to avoid certain death.

Or to take half damage from a fireball. Or to take partial damage from any number of other effects. Or to avoid effects that absolutely weren't instant death, like charm person. You're badly mischaracterizing saving throws here.

 

[the Jester]

You're not seriously arguing that anybody wasted time with item saves. Everybody tried item saves once or twice, quickly realized it was either a waste of time or just far too punitive, and just ignored them.

While that might be true for your groups, it was absolutely not universal. I always used item saves. My DMs in 1e also always used item saves. "Too punitive"? In a game where fighting a vampire or specter could easily cost you 2 levels per round? In a game replete with instant death effects, not all of which even allowed a save (hi there, catoblepas)? It sounds to me like you played in a pretty 'soft' campaign or campaigns, if you think losing some gear is too punitiive, at least compared to the ones I played in and DMed. And that's okay- it speaks to the variety of playstyles that 1e enabled- but it was absolutely not universal.